Your Mileage May Vary: Dating App Technologies, Vibrator Emasculation, Pulling Her Down, Eating And Telling

Episode Transcript

Transcript automatically generated by a robot. Apologies for any inaccuracies.

[00:00] Keith: Hello and welcome to your mileage may vary. We talk about sex and relationships with frankness that is controversial but mostly in good faith on today's show we'll be revisiting the face-sitting topic what reasonable expectations around kissing and telling are whether men should feel emasculated by a vibrator and more. I'm Keith my co-host is Mike and Mike it occurs to me that I should mention our email address at the beginning of episodes but when is the right time to do that but should I intro you first going forward. Okay.
[00:25] Mike: Sure now. Not sure.
[00:36] Keith: All right? Our email address is ymmvpoddatgmail.com if you send us feedback there we will pay you $10 just let us know how you want to be paid Paypal venmo. Whatever if you want to send us a question you can also do that there and if you don't want us to use it on air. Please specifically say so. Again, that's ymmvpod at gmail.com.
[00:57] Mike: Or you can just comment on the porn that I post on the curated Amateur porn suburbate like some people have started doing. You can just send me messages via the porn. You could send me porn now. Yeah.
[01:03] Keith: Yeah, getting shockingly good engagement there I'm a bit surprised at your ah ability to grow that subreddit it's impressiveive or depressing or sub combination of both. Um.
[01:15] Mike: We're over 10000 yeah Yeah
[01:22] Keith: So I want to talk about I have a few things for patter here. The first is I was thinking on my run today about whether or not I have been raped and there are 2 incidents. That I think I could argue were rape. Um, are you ready.
[01:46] Mike: Now. Okay, so I am I can I can I actually have something that I can say on this topic to um I Assume let's I assume just for ground rules here that you mean by a woman not by a man. Okay, so neither of us.
[01:58] Keith: Correct I have yeah.
[02:03] Mike: Has had sex with a man. Okay, okay, yeah, so I mean you can go first all I have something that I will mention.
[02:07] Keith: Okay, so the first time I was 24 or 25 I met a woman at a bar in the mission district in San Francisco the 500 club actually and we chatted for a bit. And then my friends were leaving so I got her phone number and then we had a date. We remember this was a long time ago but I went to some photo exhibition in the presidio who was like aerial photos of cities. It was really cool and then we went back to her place and we watched. I think we watched the Mtv video music awards I think they happened to be that night and we drank a lot and I was 25 so still fairly new to pinch drinking. Still don't do that very often but I was definitely new to it back then and.
[02:46] Mike: Again.
[03:03] Keith: I ended up passing out and I were falling asleep or some combination and I woke up and she was on top of me completely Naked. My clothes were off except for my underwear. And she was sort of like working on my underwear and she was on top of me so she was sort of straddling me and like riding me but I'd still had my underwear on so there wasn't any penetration and.
[03:24] Mike: Okay.
[03:33] Mike: Are you sure that you I think you should put more color on the notion of waking up. How do you know that? How do you know that you woke up right? then? Okay, that's important, but okay, 1
[03:41] Keith: Yeah I don't yeah I know I know it is um but I think oftentimes in matters like these people are super blurry about what the exact order of events and you know.
[03:55] Mike: Um, sure.
[03:59] Keith: What happened and anyway I told her yeah I was not interested and I left and so I don't so there was no penetration but would you call that incident rape I know I I guess you would not do you think. Some people would.
[04:19] Mike: Well I mean I I assume that the the game you want to play here is to reverse the genders and say would it be rape if it were a man doing it to a woman in that situation. The lack of penetration I think would be pretty protective for the man. So from kind of a legal perspective. You could talk about him. Yeah, you could talk talk about a moral perspective.
[04:25] Keith: Right? right? right.
[04:32] Keith: In a court of law. Yes.
[04:38] Mike: Um, yeah I mean there there was clearly a lack of consent. Ah, this was the first time you'd say been naked with this person is that right? Okay, so there's no, even there's nothing. You could even term like implied consent like you would have in a or something I'm not even sure that exists but like I could imagine in ah in an ongoing relationship.
[04:44] Keith: Yes, yeah, it was our first date right.
[04:56] Mike: Say Well, you know we've had and ah conversation earlier or we have so sort of patterns of behavior that make this reasonable like you didn't have any of that. So yeah I mean I think you're like sort. Yeah.
[05:03] Keith: I Think a lot of women I think a lot of women assume implied consent from men. But yeah, certainly none was explicitly given in general I agree.
[05:11] Mike: Um, and I think that's to be fair I think that is kind of a fair assumption I think that yeah I So I So I that's that's why I would tend to say no on this question. Um, because I Just think it's. You can construct a scenario where a man is raped by a woman but I think it has to be pretty aggressive and I don't think this is yeah but but if you switch the genders here I think it would be much more complicated much closer to a yes answer.
[05:34] Keith: Right? right.
[05:39] Mike: Just because I do think there's a difference I don't think this is I think there are situations where there is not perfect parity between the genders and I don't think it's actually helpful to pretend. There is yeah.
[05:45] Keith: Yeah, yeah I think that's right I don't feel any trauma related to this or I don't think it negatively impacted me ah she texted me a few times and.
[05:50] Mike: Did you what happened afterward like what? what? what was the you knew you all here? No no right afterward So she she's she's writhing on your underwear covered crotch and then what you fell asleep again like.
[06:01] Keith: Oh gosh. Yeah I don't remember exactly but I put my clothes on and left I did not fall asleep again now I I really didn't.
[06:10] Mike: Oh really, you see you did not want to have sex interesting. Ok I think that probably surprised her right? That's that's too bad. Okay, okay.
[06:20] Keith: I'm not sure I could have I was really drunk I think um but I didn't want to either.
[06:26] Mike: And she I'm sure did not really perceive that she done anything wrong. She was just texting you afterward saying.
[06:31] Keith: Yeah, and I'm not even sure. Yeah I'm not sure what magnitude of wrongdoing I think she did right all right? So that was incident 1 incident 2 was much more recently. This was like seven years ago or so.
[06:40] Mike: Sure you might not even perceived it that way either? Okay, what's the second. Yeah.
[06:50] Keith: And I met a woman from some dating app and we went on a date. She kept going on and on about how we have this like amazing connection. I wasn't really interested. Um, we did have sex on. That first date and then or maybe we went on. Yeah we went on two days we went on one day. Nothing happened, nothing physical happened and then we went on a second date we did have sex and then months went by where we didn't see each other and then I saw her one day running around the city and she was like oh hey, you know we should go out again and.
[07:20] Mike: And.
[07:29] Keith: Against my better judgment I said yes and she was at my place and we'd been drinking but not nearly as much this time and I kind of wanted her to leave and I implied that several times. And but I definitely didn't kick her out I didn't say you should leave and then she was like she was doing thing where she like you know it took her like a sweater off. She's you know, just did that they were she said it's hot in here.
[07:51] Mike: Okay.
[08:06] Keith: And yeah, it's sort of clear What she's angling toward and I said something like ah you know I'm I'm I'm pretty tired you know, maybe next time and she was like oh but I.
[08:08] Mike: Okay.
[08:23] Keith: I feel so horny would be like really connecting and so yeah I believe and then so I did I had sex with her now.
[08:24] Mike: Wow, She used the word horny. That's nice. Okay.
[08:42] Keith: This again is definitely not legally in any sort of way rape. But ah she was being sort of coercive in a way and not leaving in a way that I think if the genders were reversed people would say I'm victim blaming. For not respecting the experience of the woman clay claiming she was raped in that circumstance.
[09:05] Mike: I Think you're right I Think that's certainly a possibility I think I think these both fall into this category where this one is less um, less rapy than the first story because the lack of of being drunk I think.
[09:16] Keith: Yeah I agree yeah and having had sex before.
[09:21] Mike: Um, yes, oh I missed that part actually? Okay, so yeah, so you have 2 2 strikes against you there. But I agree with you that the standard is substantially different from men to women and I actually think that's appropriate. Um for men I think it was 2 men. If it was a gay situation then I think the standard would be much closer to the standard I would apply to a woman if that makes sense.
[09:45] Keith: Okay, yeah, it does. Um, yeah I brought it that second one because that second one I did feel really icky about after I felt like felt like sort of used and yeah like I I was.
[09:55] Mike: Um, okay, really.
[10:02] Keith: Upset at myself for not being stronger and telling her now.
[10:05] Mike: Did anything unusual happen this happen in the sexual encounter I mean was she on top most of the time or G there was no like analingus or anything unusual. Okay, interesting. Interesting. See you ultimately sort of performed as per normal.
[10:10] Keith: Now that that I remember I don't remember any now now I don't remember any like submissive or dominant play. Yeah, that's right.
[10:24] Mike: But it's still bothered you. That's interesting. Okay, yeah um yeah I can give you quickly. Ah, the 1 experience that I've had that's probably further out on the spectrum than either of yours closer. Ah so um, as detailed.
[10:28] Keith: So.
[10:36] Keith: All right? Let's go.
[10:43] Mike: People can listen back say last August or something there were some episodes where I described various pharmaceutical experiences I've had um there is 1 particular drug that I take very occasionally that amounts to not quite to the level but amounts to like roofying yourself. Um.
[10:57] Keith: Okay.
[11:00] Mike: And so one of its side effects is ah is anterograde amnesia where you forget what happened was happening so a little bit like drunkenness but it's it's more profound than that. Um, and I definitely have had the experience of taking that and then essentially waking up. Meaning coming to my senses while having sex and it bothers it bothers me so I actually have had a conversation with my wife about that and we do not. You know, not do that if if it's very a very occasional that I would take it but I actually don't it bothers me because I I.
[11:28] Keith: Huh.
[11:34] Mike: There is some sort of thing that happens where like you get your wits back about you and I don't it just doesn't feel right if I'm like oh like yeah somehow the the comedown is much faster than it is from alcohol if that makes sense So so there is some that that and and and probably having sex I could imagine it accelerating it ah because.
[11:46] Keith: Ah, yeah.
[11:53] Mike: Yeah, maybe it's just because it's exercise or some hormonal thing or something and so you yeah you can have this moment of realization where you're like wait when did we start having sex like what like what's going on here and that's it's pretty pretty pretty bothersome now I mean in that case I would say it's important for the partner to understand with drunkenness people are going to be much more.
[11:57] Keith: Ah.
[12:02] Keith: Yeah.
[12:12] Mike: Um, used to it like people are much more knowledgeable about alcohol and so when you get into other medications and drugs. They might not understand it and I'm sure this comes up frankly in in rape trials and stuff where like the guys like look I didn't know this could do this to you? Okay, you know which is true.
[12:19] Keith: Right.
[12:25] Keith: Right.
[12:28] Mike: And so yeah, then ultimately like a conversation's needed and but I but I I vibe with your notion of like the icky feeling like it's like yeah, there's something about like you're like yeah I don't It's not that you didn't enjoy it or something. It's just like yeah I didn't really want to do that or like there's something that bothers you about it. Yeah.
[12:43] Keith: Right? Yeah yeah, um yeah I don't feel like I carry any significant trauma from either of those. But yeah.
[12:51] Mike: Yeah, no, but it's just not great. It's like you'd rather not have that happen again. Yeah.
[12:59] Keith: I Wonder if women I've had sex with would report similar I I don't feel like I'm very coercive I feel like I am super guarded against being coercive. But of course people's mileage may vary. Yeah.
[13:07] Mike: I Think the problem is that when somebody's drunk. It's it's yeah, it's it's it's the alcohol consumption you're going I mean so the answer is almost certainly yes, but not but probably around the same level that you're experiencing where they go. Oh maybe I would have made a different choice and it sort of bothers them particularly if the relationship doesn't go anywhere.
[13:26] Keith: Right? Yeah, people might feel particularly bad if they get ghosted after a drunken sexual encounter. Ah.
[13:27] Mike: Yeah.
[13:33] Mike: I'm not suggesting you would you would ghost someone you're a gentleman and a scholar I assume but ah, you might you might just not go anywhere. You know, maybe there would be a kind of a a mutual agreement to break up. Yeah.
[13:42] Keith: Right? right? okay.
[13:47] Mike: I Think if anybody was going to ghost people would be me. Yeah.
[13:49] Keith: I Think that that feels probable. Ah all right? Let's move on from the the rape talk. Um so I promised last episode to try to share one of my one of the dating apps I use and we can evaluate some of the yeah.
[14:03] Mike: Yes.
[14:08] Keith: Eligible bachelorettes here. Well we can evaluate them for eligibility and because I've been disappointed with my my pool lately and we're going to use hinge here because I think hinge has the highest quality and the least amount of spam and fake accounts.
[14:10] Mike: Yes.
[14:21] Mike: Right? And you so I have up on my screen here. You've shared screens with me and I see your phone you somehow amazingly through some technological wizardry have made it so your phone is visible on my screen I see an attractive looking woman and I have my.
[14:34] Keith: Yep.
[14:39] Mike: My um pants unzipped So I'm ready.
[14:41] Keith: Do we need to like protect names or anything I don't think we do I think this is yeah okay so this is Rachel do you think she's a little bit cross-eyed. She's her primary picture says my good side and she is at a restaurant she is drinking a glass of red wine. She's in a.
[14:46] Mike: It's just a first name. So yeah. And and.
[14:59] Keith: White top with off of 1 shoulder and looks to be eating. Maybe some eggplant maybe some Mediterranean dish there.
[15:09] Mike: It's odd that she would pick this photo I mean. So yeah, importantly, she's drinking some wine and her face is a little bit scrunched up because of that. Ah she but my immediate take when I saw this picture was this looks like a woman on a cam site. Ah, pretending to have an orgasm.
[15:27] Keith: Yeah, she does have that sort of look on her face that people do and they pretend to be coming. Ah so her right? The her first prompt is to me relaxation is and she writes passing out on the beach but not burning.
[15:31] Mike: Yes, yes, most women by the way would close their eyes when they're orgasming. That's much more common but okay.
[15:44] Keith: Playing golf or tennis and hanging out with my pup and friends So that's a fairly basic I mean I bet she lives in the marina would be my guess.
[15:52] Mike: I don't like to do any of those things. So then I would just be like Pat what what does passing out on the beach mean does that mean alcohol and drugs or does that mean just she's tired all the time I think I'm too restless of a person like I don't think I would.
[16:04] Keith: I'm not sure I'm not I don't know what she's trying to virtue signal by any of these things with any of these things.
[16:11] Mike: Anyway I don't want to. We don't need to like I don't know if we need to go into every single thing she says but that's that's pretty uncompeling to me.
[16:11] Keith: Yeah, all right here's another picture here. She's looks like at a tennis match. She's no this is just the first one I can't.
[16:22] Mike: Did you pick this woman because you knew I would hate her Okay is this? Okay so this is her with is that a picture of rafa on the doll there.
[16:29] Keith: So he and only shows you 1 person at a time so this is the only person I can possibly see right now. It is yeah I mean her figure her figure is trim she looks.
[16:38] Mike: Right? It's his strong arm. She's a go down a little bit. She's a little bit chunky in my opinion like she's wearing she's learning what? well.
[16:44] Keith: Yeah, now there's now there's she's included a video of her golfing is this streaming quickly enough so that you can see the video.
[16:50] Mike: It a little bit. It looks like she might be wearing spanx.
[16:55] Keith: Yeah, she's wearing compression shorts.
[16:58] Mike: Is she the one now this next thing she wrote about Pamela Anderson this is not I mean do you want Pamela and I mean so the person says because I'm not saying this. Ah.
[17:02] Keith: Yeah, why don't you read it.
[17:13] Mike: Rachel says Pamela Anderson is extremely well read and interested in art architecture and poetry her book was such a who funre who the fuck would read Pamela Anderson's book now I know who buys this garb bitch. You would are yeah I mean okay, you so this is this is tough. This is tough.
[17:22] Keith: Well, this is what she chooses to virtue signal on a dating app right.
[17:31] Keith: Okay, so all right We we have so this is can I zoom in on this. Yeah I can all right? Yeah, she's in a bikini looks like on a Hawaiian beach.
[17:33] Mike: Yeah, I'm not yeah I can see it well enough. It's her at maybe? ah well I'm not sure where she is maybe Hawaii or something.
[17:47] Keith: Okay, the final prompt is I won't shut up about whatever book I'm currently reading and local politics who's going to be the next d two supervisor so that's no, you can choose between like 15 prompts.
[17:54] Mike: Do you think this is the so everybody gets the same prompts. So if I went on this app and I said I won't shut up about the most recent amateur porn that I saw on Reddit would that get me a lot of likes.
[18:08] Keith: You could do that? No most people try to virtue signal something original and attractive and I don't think she's done that in any of her all right? all right? Let's let all right? So that's Rachel I'm going to x her.
[18:14] Mike: Okay. My porn thing would be repellent I Assume yeah.
[18:28] Keith: And see who comes up next here she's gone.
[18:28] Mike: So so wait, you've xed her so wait. How does this work now if you had you've lost her. She's gone. But if you had not Exed her. Ah do you have to wait to see if she says yes to you or can you keep going proceeding. Is it just like in other words is it just like tinder where you swipe left and swipe right and you can keep going or or do you have to stop? Okay, okay, okay, usually do pay right? Is there. Some reason you don't paper for hinge.
[18:45] Keith: You can keep swipe swiping I think on hinge you can only swipe ten yeses a day if you don't pay and I do not pay for hinge.
[18:59] Keith: Ah, no I don't know why I don't pay for hinge. Maybe I should.
[19:01] Mike: You You said it's the highest quality. Okay, maybe there's some feature like because you've you've earlier said that you can I mean for example I don't know if you you make use of this but I know that a paid thing you can do with say Tinder is you can find out who is up to swipe right on you.
[19:18] Keith: I think hinge does that by default or maybe I am paying for hinge. No I don't think I am paying for hinge I Hinge does tell you see this little heart down here I could see who's liked me but I don't have any.
[19:18] Mike: It just saves time right? You can.
[19:24] Mike: All righty. Okay, okay so this is l.
[19:35] Keith: It's this Nobodys likes you yet. Yeah, it's mean um, but that's because I you normally check it in the mornings and either swipe yes or say no to the people who have liked me ok all right here we have l ah, this picture is very dark. It's really hard to say anything.
[19:36] Mike: Brutal.
[19:52] Keith: It's strange. She's added a couple things to the photo and do you.
[19:52] Mike: Um.
[19:58] Mike: Ah, the top right thing is a is a picture that is one of those pictures where if you um, it's all I mean Okay, she's trying to be clever. It's one of those pictures where if you look at it. It looks like an old woman or it looks like a pretty woman's head depending on like and your brain will sort of interpret it differently I recognize it because it's a standard thing.
[20:08] Keith: I See that.
[20:15] Mike: Fine. So she's trying to like you know, blow your mind.
[20:18] Keith: Okay, and she says her simple pleasures are eating fruit and taking walks great. She went to Berkeley it says. Okay, here's another no no, it's a glass of wine.
[20:26] Mike: Um, good here. She is with a bong set a bong you know oh my back.
[20:37] Mike: Okay, alrighty.
[20:38] Keith: Yeah, yeah, that's a glass of wine um does this person across the attractiveness threshold for you.
[20:45] Mike: I mean she's young and attractive right? She's so it looks like she's pretty young there and so so I mean it's so far sure I mean Jesus.
[20:51] Keith: I can't say enough about her face. The first picture was too dark. The third picture is from behind and the second picture is oh this one here. It might be I don't think that is the Vatican though.
[20:59] Mike: Is that a picture from the Vatican or something we'll just know that. Yeah, the next one? Yeah, okay yeah, okay.
[21:11] Keith: It's from a european cathedral for sure all right? She has another prompt here. The 1 thing you should know about me is I try to minimize my time spent looking at my phone.
[21:17] Mike: Okay, she's not that attractive that you got to a picture where I could see her face clearly. Yeah I'm not I'm I'm going to X her for sure.
[21:24] Keith: Yeah, but she's also okay Mike Do you see the problem here like when ah all of these prompts are just inviting you to say something that's unique and like virtue signaling.
[21:30] Mike: Yeah, one is the.
[21:40] Mike: Okay.
[21:41] Keith: Ah, something interesting and I think all of these women gets that they're either totally boring which I guess is possible or they have so many inbound likes that they don't care to even try to a B test various prompt responses.
[21:54] Mike: Well, they're certainly not a B testing prompt responses I don't I think it's somewhere in between those two that I'm sure they have a lot more inbound than than any man does.
[22:02] Keith: Right? All right? I'm going to go to the next one you want to see anything more here.
[22:06] Mike: Okay, now I called it. She's got the whole Earth catalog there. She's obviously like kind of trying to ape some sort of Hippie vibe I got that generally about her. Yeah.
[22:10] Keith: Right? right? All right? I'm exing her. She's gone. Okay, now we're on Caitlin now Caitlin's first photo is of 2 people. So for now we don't know which one she is.
[22:19] Mike: There's.
[22:22] Mike: Yeah, but you have a way way, but you have a rule about this. What's your rule.
[22:28] Keith: I mean it's you should assume it's the uglier of the 2 i.
[22:31] Mike: Yeah, so there's a couple I mean I'm going to tell you a couple other listeners a couple other rules Keith has because I found these to be very useful if you're following if you're if you're behind a woman on the street and she's wearing sunglasses or if you just can't see her face but her figure is very compelling. She's ugly right.
[22:49] Keith: That's that's a good rule of thumb. Yes.
[22:51] Mike: Yes, sunglasses or if you just don't see the face. Yeah in your in your mind being the optimistic gentleman you generally are is going to fill in something awesome. So you have 2 choices you can simply never look at her face and then just kind of have that experience or you can go ahead and see the face in which case you will be disappointed so you have to kind of make that Hopson's choice
[23:02] Keith: Um, movement.
[23:07] Keith: Yeah I mean given an absence of information the mind fills in like a perfect 10 I don't know why it does that that seems a bit maladaptive to me. But that's what it does. She did how I don't I don't remember.
[23:16] Mike: So this woman this woman is given her pronouns I see that the other ones didn't with ones did not yeah it says she her hearers they did not. They didn't trust me, it triggered me when I thought second thing is I'm going to go with she's the one on the left. Are you agreeing? Oh but.
[23:24] Keith: I Think the other ones may have I don't remember ok all right. You would have noticed. Okay, we'll see we'll see ok this shall I think these two are ah sort of equivalent to attractiveness I like the teeth of the one on the left.
[23:36] Mike: Are you agreeing that the one on the left is the less attractive, interesting and teeth. Okay.
[23:44] Keith: Better than the one on the right? Um, but they're around the same for me all right? Ah, the one prompt we can see is weirdest gift I've given or received I was given a dancing Granny's workout video for my birthday once? Ok, ok.
[23:48] Mike: All righty.
[23:57] Mike: Okay, that.
[24:02] Keith: I Don't know why she chose had prompt to respond to ok so now the next thing is a video. Oh ok I think she's the brunette was the one on the right know are your arch Jeistic was wrong.
[24:11] Mike: Fuck It is the one on the right damn it. Well you're well I mean for me your rule didn't work for you. You you said they were equal. Well you said they were equal. So maybe the rule works for for your attractiveness. Um, metrics.
[24:21] Keith: Yeah, ok, this video is kind of funny. Actually it's she's with a bunch of puppies and she's wearing one of these dresses that is sort of wrap around and that puppies are tugging on the strings. Vaguely undressing. Her.
[24:38] Mike: Yeah god.
[24:40] Keith: They're not succeeding but it's sort of a funny video like that video. Okay, her third picture is a can with 3 people. Um, so there used to be this game where you would get.
[24:56] Keith: There were like 5 letters and you could guess letters and for each letter you guessed it would say whether that letter appeared in the actual 5 letter word and if it was in the right spot or oh yeah I guess they did do that in wortle there was a game like that that was with numbers I think was called balderda maybe or maybe I'm thinking of something else now balderdash or something else. Anyway.
[25:06] Mike: Isn't that word wordle. Yes.
[25:13] Mike: Figure I don't know no.
[25:16] Keith: Yeah, like you're doing this sort of game to like try to figure out which person this is but I think it's the middle person right? Ok but I mean we've spent a lot of time on this like normally if you're just like swiping quickly. It's can be a pain to do this.
[25:20] Mike: Yeah, well yes, yes, in this case I Believe so.
[25:32] Mike: Well, it's a clever thing if she wants you to look more at her profile. She puts multiple people there. Um, the standard thing I mean would be to have the more attractive woman with you as the less attractive woman thereby getting more people looking at your profile of course then most will be disappointed. But there's some sort of sad theory there that the guys will change their mind.
[25:35] Keith: Now Uns supposed.
[25:49] Keith: Right.
[25:50] Mike: Because they read something for example, reading that you like to do karaoke with Cheryl Crow Stevie Nix or shaiah twain songs that that actually gave me an an erection I got hard now.
[25:55] Keith: Yeah that's her next prompt her go to terryoka home Shel Crow Stevie Nix or shaiah Twain. So again I don't know why she chose that prompt to respond to or why she thinks that answer like is her personality being. Basic.
[26:16] Mike: So you're basically saying that her profile you are looking at the profile and you're saying her profile basically says she's an idiot. Yes.
[26:21] Keith: I mean it. It's that I mean it does that right? like it doesn't say I read foreign affairs in my Iqs one 30 which is something I would like to be able to say but I can't because I sound like an asshole so I have to like cleverly virtue signal it somehow which I think I have done in my profile but way.
[26:39] Mike: I I don't actually understand Um, when you say that are you trying to signal that you read sort of a Semi-inferior Foreign Policy magazine and that you're not that smart or are you trying to suggest that you read a lot and are that smart.
[26:52] Keith: Um, see this is the kind of conversation I would like to be having with a would be partner.
[26:56] Mike: I See you want them to you. Want them to belittle you for only having a one thirty Iq Yeah, okay.
[27:02] Keith: Right? And right we could argue about you know, drudge report versus the New York Times and you know we we could have highbrow conversations. Ah yes.
[27:09] Mike: Wait wait just to be fair just to be fair I'm the one saying the drudge report is compelling not Keith so he's making fun of me there I didn't want you I want you tarred with that one I'll take that one short.
[27:20] Keith: Thanks Mike I appreciate that such a good wig man. Ah ok worse that I participated in Steve Madden platforms neon plaid in a shirt with the chiwawa saying shut up on it although it could have also been the best. Okay can I can we where I'm going to ex her and go to the next person. Yeah, let's do.
[27:32] Mike: Can we just move on I'm yeah at some point I'm going to be curious like hear what you think these women okay 2 more and then I think we should talk about what you think they should be doing. Okay, so this also has given her pronouns.
[27:38] Keith: Let's do 2 more.
[27:42] Keith: Okay, all right we have Wendy she her hers. Ah, you're going to say you don't like this person doesn't cross the attractiveness threshold for you a little bit. Yeah.
[27:52] Mike: She is overweight. She's not athletic enough for me. Yeah, like area.
[28:01] Keith: I Like this sized woman be beyond this. It starts to bother me. But at this size she it's sort of yeah she seems I think what my body is thinking is she seems fertile.
[28:15] Mike: Yeah I mean it turns out that most women's bodies are fertile So but ah, okay.
[28:18] Keith: Yeah, true, um, okay, typical Sunday includes friends mimosas laughs sun live music and the outdoors.
[28:27] Mike: What would you if you? Okay, so if you were telling the truth. What would you say you would say you'd go for a run. You'd say you masturbate once or twice you what like read crap on your computer. The rest of the day or something I actually don't know. Okay, okay.
[28:34] Keith: Um, yeah, yeah.
[28:42] Keith: Yeah, something like that. Yeah yeah I do actually normally go to dolores park and go for a walk around the park and people watch um and then yeah, it's some like combination of reading on my computer and reading reading.
[28:47] Mike: Okay, okay.
[28:55] Mike: Right? And and mine would be I can't even say what mine would be the incomprehensible. It's a secret she says she speaks Spanish She doesn't.
[29:05] Keith: She might she might be Hispanic I can't tell you don't think there's a chance doesn't she seem like she could be hispanic.
[29:07] Mike: She okay.
[29:14] Mike: Like it's possible. It's possible. It's just it's just it's it's something about the combination of people who who want to call it out in a dating profile or something. It's like that it's may maybe but yeah.
[29:20] Keith: Ah, yeah, that.
[29:32] Mike: Maybe.
[29:32] Keith: The 1 thing you should know about me is that I am horrible at texting she says now super important now now it's the same woman.
[29:38] Mike: That's the 1 thing I should know about her. Wow that's okay, did you just oh wait. Did you ex her went to some woman with gigantic breasts. Okay I see she's showing her her assets now it's nice. And then her low-key Flex is Machu Picchu
[29:54] Keith: Um, yeah, that's like the ah yeah I mean I Okay can I Next all right here's our here's our last one.
[30:03] Mike: Yeah, yeah, unless you want to heart her. It looks like you can heart. You can heart individual pictures on this thing not just her.
[30:13] Keith: Yeah, a heart so they have this concept of a rose and you get 1 rose a week and ah to buy a rose cost three ninety nine so you can rose multiple people but it's expensive to do so um, but yeah I can heart.
[30:14] Mike: Okay.
[30:25] Mike: Do you ever get roses. Do you do you ever get roses Keith have you ever gotten a rose from a woman that you found compelling. Yeah, that's what I figured. Okay.
[30:28] Keith: I can heart any of these things and it'll tell them that that's the thing that I hearted it happens but it's unusual now. Yeah, um.
[30:43] Mike: So but you realize there are some guys out there getting roses from the compelling women or do you think that there aren't.
[30:51] Keith: That's an interesting point. Ah yeah, because hinge. Even if you don't pay for it shows you who's liked you women may never have to give roses.
[31:01] Mike: I see I see it might be considered too forward.
[31:08] Keith: I'm not sure I mean it's possible that I am not attractive enough either physically or in my profile to attract people to give me roses but okay, we can do that next all right? So here's Lauren Lauren is
[31:19] Mike: Ah, what? what? I should do. We should go through your profile. Oh my lord. Oh my lord. Okay.
[31:27] Keith: You're not going to think she's attractive am I right.
[31:32] Mike: Um, not sure yet, but probably not.
[31:32] Keith: Okay, all right. She says her simple pleasures are an extra dirty martini with blue cheese olives an empty metal seat on a plane and an uber driver not known for great conversation. Those are.
[31:43] Mike: Yeah, that's what is your simple pleasure Keith I mean I guess it's beating off. But other than that other than porn and beating off and being a sex addicted as one of our commenters said about us. Yes.
[31:59] Keith: Accused us of yeah so this person is a manager at grub grub hub. Yeah I don't know. Yeah, we can look at mine. Um, okay, she what she would do.
[32:01] Mike: Nothing I don't know no no wait it. What is it? What's what's your what's your simple pleasure I Guess we'll look at your profile in a minute fine. We can. We can find out. Okay, she's open to a short term relationship. Well we shouldn't We shouldn't say where she went to college or something that's too.
[32:16] Keith: Yeah, but it's probably because me okay, that's fine grub hub was I not supposed to say there's no way that there's.
[32:20] Mike: Too much info right? Did you say where she worked widow. Ok, fine, fine. So here we have a picture with 3 women. It's unclear which one she is but none of the 3 looks like she could necessarily be in a rowboat by herself safely.
[32:30] Keith: Yo.
[32:39] Keith: He yeah is um, man poor lauren ah, the 1 thing I'd love to know about you is how early do you get to the airport before your flight. That's a decent virtue signal.
[32:40] Mike: That's concerning.
[32:52] Mike: Okay.
[32:59] Keith: But so a man you you want to create a profile that has something that people can glom onto and respond to and so that question is something that I might respond to although I've seen that question on like a thousand people's profiles and I I know that people do feel very strongly about whether you should get to the airport early or late.
[33:04] Mike: Okay I do it.
[33:11] Mike: Have you? okay.
[33:18] Keith: And so you I wouldn't want to risk guessing incorrectly.
[33:25] Mike: It's pretty obvious from the wording of this question that she wants you to say you get in you get there pretty early I think okay wait I Want to guess oh like she's not going to tell us where the photo was taken. We have to just guess okay and here she is.
[33:31] Keith: I'm not sure maybe all right? This is getting boring So that's.
[33:40] Keith: Yeah, looks like it. Yeah.
[33:40] Mike: With her dog. They all have dogs right? Yeah ok so so Keith what do you think women should do before we get to your profile. What do you? what's what? what's what what's the mistake they're making here. What should they do? Oh ok.
[33:52] Keith: I don't I don't know like so all of these women are ah were not none of them were really above the attractiveness bar but let's say they were and I had to choose 1 of them based on their profiles I don't.
[34:03] Mike: Okay, ah.
[34:10] Keith: I don't know what I want them to virtue signal in these prompts I mean it's it's awkward but I would like them to imply that there are there's more to their life than just like having brunch with their friends and having momosas in the park which is basically what all 5 of these women or 6 of these women I don't know how many we did say.
[34:28] Mike: Right.
[34:30] Keith: Like indicate a hobby or you know an interest in something intellectual and none of these women do that.
[34:40] Mike: I'm I'm surprised by the fact that um, the photos aren't all maybe I'm just polluted by other things I've seen but I'm surprised the photos don't always contain a bikini photo or like just a very revealing photo.
[34:53] Keith: I don't think they need to I think on seeking they do because you're basically competing a but against a bunch of 22 year old college students. But I think on hinge. There's.
[34:56] Mike: Okay.
[35:03] Mike: Okay.
[35:13] Keith: So many thirsty men that incrementally making their profile 10% better or 80% better or whatever doesn't matter because they already have an infinite supply.
[35:23] Mike: Okay, and maybe it would It wouldn't the additional supply. It would get them would not be compelling that That's another thing about that. Yeah, you.
[35:29] Keith: I think it would be Mike I think it would be I think they're I think with lazy approaches like this and they don't even know they're being lazy right? They don't know that their profiles are bad. They're like oh I just did this and I got plenty of inbounds right? They don't know that like. How can I say this? what I was going to say is they don't know that the people like me are swiping no on them. They don't know that people who actually are are high value and I may or may not be but the ones who are actually high value and are like carefully considering are are noting on them.
[36:00] Mike: So you think they should show their basically show their ass off and show what about their personality show some.
[36:06] Keith: I don't think they should be in a immodest bikini you know bent over. But if if they're you know? Yeah, if there's some way that you can show off your body like I think I have a picture of me with my shirt off we can. We'll pull up my my profile in a second.
[36:12] Mike: Kind of.
[36:24] Mike: Right? Maybe maybe them in a swimsuit or something like like what I I realize that's the same as a bikini but like let's say they're at the pool and it looks like they've actually been swimming or something where it's like yeah and then in their profile. They should be signaling I mean there's like there are 2 directions I can see that going one is.
[36:26] Keith: But I don't think it's.
[36:32] Keith: Or something. Yes, yes, it did.
[36:42] Mike: Signaling that they'd be great at sex and the other one is signaling that they'd be a compelling partner ah meaning someone the person would actually want to hang out with and talk to which of those 2 would you go for the the compelling partner I assume not not she shouldn't be just signaling that she's great at sucking cock or something.
[36:57] Keith: Yeah I don't think they should signal that they're a whore.
[37:01] Mike: No, you can be good at sucking cock without being a whore.
[37:06] Keith: Okay, describe this photo the photo of somebody who's indicating that they're good at sucking cock but is not sexually promiscuous.
[37:08] Mike: Which photo. No no, it would be that it would be the text. It would be the text and the profile maybe could I don't Know. No no, you're you're that you're making a different Argument. You're making the argument that there is no piece of text that would not simultaneous that would. They could signal. They're good at sex without simultaneously signaling that they are promiscuous I Think that's what you're saying maybe there is such a piece of text where they basically say yeah um like they so ah, they're like ah how about this thing you should know about me.
[37:34] Keith: Maybe there is I can't imagine what it is.
[37:44] Mike: Very monogamous but have studied the Comma sutra carefully or something.
[37:48] Keith: Yeah, maybe something like that I don't think women need to do anything on that Axis I think they need to include a full body shot whether it be in a swimsuit or a cocktail dress or something and then they can do whatever they want with their other photos but they should.
[37:58] Mike: Okay, so you think the text doesn't matter.
[38:06] Keith: No I think the text does matter on and in the percentiles at the at the edges.
[38:09] Mike: Okay, okay, so so would this would something that signals that they while being interested in a long term relationship would be good at sex would something signaling that be smart. Okay.
[38:17] Keith: Now I don't think that helps at all. No I don't think there are I think there are literally like actually literally 0 men. They would exclude someone that doesn't specifically say they're good at sex. They just assume it's like the blonde and sunglasses like they if you.
[38:31] Mike: Okay, okay, so then it should It should be the text should be indicating that there's something about them that makes them a compelling person and and and your your point is well taken that saying that they like to hang out with their friends and eat cheese on a weekend is not. It's It's very ordinary. It should be.
[38:33] Keith: Can see that their figures good. They just assume they're good that it doesn't need to be made explicit.
[38:41] Keith: Um, yes.
[38:47] Keith: Everybody likes those things like when you are making like let's say you're college professor and you're making an an exam you want every question to have basically a 50% answer rate with a huge standard deviation on it so that you can separate the smart people from the dumb people if you say that you like.
[38:51] Mike: Right.
[39:01] Mike: Right.
[39:07] Keith: Having brunch you've not done that you've said you're a normal human and.
[39:11] Mike: Right? right? So would be like so would be something like you know, think something you should know about me would be like um I've scuba dived on all 6 continents or I've skied all the double black diamonds at Squaa Valley or something like that something where it's like oh you look at and you're like huh.
[39:23] Keith: Um, yeah, something like that. Yeah.
[39:26] Mike: That's you just they the as you look at them their life and say what is the thing about me that if someone knew this, they'd be like oh that that's that's cool. That's impressive that makes sense. Yeah I think you're right.
[39:30] Keith: Yes, yes, you should and there and there is some sort of dance where you want to like feign Modesty but all right? Let's see let's see let's go to my profile here and then.
[39:36] Mike: Sure yeah I can't wait to see the shirtless Keith here gonna I'm going to zip back up my pant there is the shirtless I'm mean I am putting my penis away and okay.
[39:46] Keith: Ah, how do I even see. Okay.
[39:51] Keith: Okay I do not show my pronouns.
[39:59] Mike: In this in this picture your main picture I think you look a little bit like um Kramer and Seinfeld. No, it's not. It's the facial expression. It's the facial expression. Not the yeah.
[40:05] Keith: While that's mean ah I guess I do look a little bit like Kramer admit. Yeah, so there is a app I can't remember what it's called, but you can upload a photo and ah people review it.
[40:23] Keith: To say whether it you look attractive whether you look trustworthy and whether you look or whether you look. There's some other Axis and this photo scored the best on everything by far. Yeah, yes, they should and it's easy to do.
[40:30] Mike: Okay, then that's the one you should use I mean I think that's really intelligent men should do that? Yeah yeah, whatever it costs I mean it's I Assume you have to pay it right? But it's worth it. Yeah.
[40:42] Keith: Um, yeah, so but the first photo is me. It's a headshot I'm in a tuxedo I appear to be at some sort of fancy event and yeah, it's sort of up to the viewer to decide. Um.
[41:00] Keith: The first prompt I answered is what makes me happy and I said deep water. Okay, you can't search on hinge anyways. But I don't I don't care Anyway, I probably.
[41:02] Mike: Wait if you hang on if you read all this stuff out. Someone might be able to find you on hinge. Okay, go ahead. Oh okay, fine.
[41:17] Mike: Sure sure.
[41:17] Keith: I'm going to say my Instagram which I do have on here. What makes me happy deep water cookies ad hoc traveling plans something to look forward to and so you might say well that isn't very specific. That's very vague and it is but I'm trying to cast. As wide a net as possible. So I think that women don't need to do that. They can actually try to filter people with their various stuff but I'm trying to be sort of yeah vague and ambiguous about like what my likes and dislikes are.
[41:42] Mike: Right? right.
[41:52] Mike: Right? That's right, You can't put something like what makes me happy you know deep but tight Vaginas you have to be careful about that. Yeah, okay, so we got some photos here less less text than the women had.
[42:01] Keith: Right? right.
[42:07] Keith: Yeah, so I did my hinge profile a long time ago and so I didn't have to do as many Prompts. We'll see what else I have in here. Okay, so my second picture is a picture of me and my dad and my dad we're on Vacation. We Both have our shirts off I like this photo. Because yeah I think I look decent and I think my dad looks pretty good and yes I did it scored. Well.
[42:29] Mike: Did you pay to test this photo as well. Yeah, okay, do you think anybody's confused and think maybe that it's your dad That's the profile.
[42:38] Keith: I don't think so it says my age and my dad is clearly 30 years older than that age. Yeah, it might be better to move this photo third or something. Yeah.
[42:44] Mike: Okay, well, it's just because you are doing the thing that some of the women do with having an extra person in there. Um.
[42:50] Mike: And probably not. It's probably pretty obvious okay here you're you're signaling that you are a judeochristian with a Christmas tree I think it's a religious symbol.
[43:01] Keith: Yeah, and I'm with my mom's dog that that dog is now dead actually.
[43:08] Mike: Yeah, that's good. You okay all righty That's probably smart though because given the ah preponderance of dogs I saw in the women's profiles maybe signaling around dogs is smart here.
[43:17] Keith: Ah, um.
[43:22] Keith: Yeah people like dogs. Yeah, um, okay, the next prompt is where to find me at the party I said taking it upon myself to ensure everyone is enjoying themselves should be themselves themselves every wine.
[43:25] Mike: Yeah, okay.
[43:32] Mike: So yeah, you you brutalized yourself here. You caught it at least? Yeah yeah, you have a grammatical error in your profile. It's not. It's not good. No you will fix it after the recording I hope.
[43:39] Keith: Is enjoying. Yeah, that's brutal I got to fix that right now.
[43:50] Mike: You're not, You're not actually going to go fix it right now. Are you all right? Well I guess I'll to oh it looks like it's a free. Okay yeah, every will yeah the word everyone is for sure plural. Yeah.
[43:59] Keith: No ok, it's fixed. Um, okay, the next I might have yeah's it's brutal Anyway, it's fixed. Ah, okay, the next photo is me at a well Why don't you say? what? do you think I'm trying to signal with this photo.
[44:03] Mike: That's much better. You might have lost a few women on that one actually genuinely. Yeah.
[44:18] Mike: The than the next one. Ah I'm mean I'm goingnna use my knowledge of you to say that you are signaling How frustrated you get when you show up at a date and the woman is late because you have your phone sitting on the tip on the on on the table in front of you. You're looking to your left.
[44:19] Keith: Yeah.
[44:32] Keith: Ah.
[44:34] Mike: You you have sort of a Stern expression. You have a half drunk glass of wine but there is no paired glass of wine for the woman obvious in the picture. There's some kind of mug there. But yeah, so it looks like you're by yourself.
[44:43] Keith: Ah, okay, that is definitely not what I'm trying to signal in this photo I'm at a I at like a restaurant with a bunch of friends here I was trying to signal that I do social things.
[44:49] Mike: Um, okay.
[44:55] Mike: Okay, there's no friends in the photo.
[44:59] Keith: I know but I don't think you should have other people in your online dating profile photos.
[45:05] Mike: Okay, but how it can't signal that if there are no other people in the photo.
[45:10] Keith: Yes, it can I'm looking to my left because I'm participating in the conversation and there are 3 glasses visible on the table.
[45:17] Mike: I Have to be honest when I'm doing some like kind of hard work on something and I'm sort of like thinking out loud I will turn to my left and talk sometimes as if there's someone over there So to me I think that maybe you're just talking to yourself I'm I'm mostly teasing you but it doesn't actually look did you did you pay to have this one.
[45:28] Keith: Ha.
[45:35] Keith: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, you don't have to pay that you just have to wait like a day though you could pay to get it faster. Yeah test online dating photo website.
[45:35] Mike: Wrote do you? you pay Dev all your photos road tested right? Ok yeah I mean it it doesn't convey that to me. Ok, it's free if it's free then who the hell wouldn't do it. That's crazy.
[45:53] Keith: Yeah, it's called photo feeler. Anyone's wondering. Oh yeah, all right typical Sunday says I'm here seeking atypical Sundays whatever I'm just being vague.
[45:53] Mike: Okay, what's your typical Sunday because it's next.
[46:06] Mike: That's reasonable I mean you yeah see the the thing about this is that it's it's yeah, you're not um, you don't have to do the same thing women would do. You're casting a wide net which made that that strategically makes sense to me I yes, you have a photo of yourself like um, you're obviously not. You're in a country where they drive on the right? Um I'm not an expert I know they're people that are experts at that game. What's it called where you like dig up picture. Yeah I'm okay at that game I'm not so great. But I'm going to go with this is um western or you probably eastern europe this is Eastern Europe probably
[46:21] Keith: Move. Yeah, where you have to identify where a photo is was taken. Yeah.
[46:39] Keith: Ah, it is far far western Europe it's Iceland it's an island off the coast of Iceland actually and then yeah, my last photo is me at Petra and Jordan.
[46:49] Mike: Oh ok Alreadyy is that is is that okay I mean I've so I've never been to petro but I have seen um Indiana Jones in the ah.
[46:56] Keith: Yeah I think you're about to say something clever here. But I'm going to let you say it go ahead.
[47:02] Mike: Yeah, well, it's like it's the way you have the picture set up here. It looks like you're a giant because I know that Petra is much larger than this but you've somehow found a miniaturized version of Petra where where it's only like I'm going to go fifteen feet tall but I know that Petra is more like or like the main kind of edifice. There is more like.
[47:14] Keith: Yeah.
[47:20] Keith: Yeah, yeah, that main edifice there is called the treasury. It's definitely more than forty feet tall it's probably closer to 60 or 70 So I am on a cliff that is maybe fifty feet off the ground and this angle makes it so that you can't see that there's a huge gap between that that cliff.
[47:21] Mike: Forty feet tall or something right? Okay, okay, okay, like.
[47:37] Mike: I see.
[47:40] Keith: And ah the treasury and the distance there. But yeah, it does make it look somewhat underwhelming.
[47:48] Mike: It's not that it's it made me think it was a different but made me question so that is in fact, the treasury there just behind.
[47:51] Keith: Yeah, and you've seen the shot that everyone's seen is the cliff that I'm on is the top of the Canyon and everyone's seen the picture like looking down the Canyon towards the treasury and I'm on top of the cliff that makes that Canyon makes one side of that canyon.
[48:04] Mike: I Have to be honest that I've mostly seen the so I mean I do know for example that inside of there. There is this room with an old man in it who's guarding some chalices and I know which one is the Holy grail.
[48:13] Keith: Ask the fouted view.
[48:18] Mike: As yeah I know all all those things in there like when you take the wrong one. There's an earthquake and all that sort of stuff I Assume that's all in there right? That's how that place works.
[48:24] Keith: Yeah, yeah, the yeah, that's um, nobody's chosen the right chalice yet. Unfortunately.
[48:31] Mike: Yes, yes, so the guy just hangs out in there that makes sense. Yeah I mean this is that that that makes sense like yeah I I wonder what percentage of women are able to identify. Um these locations and how what what kinds? yeah.
[48:41] Keith: I Get a lot of a lot of people will like that photo and say where is this and that's immediately exclusionary for me.
[48:51] Mike: Yeah I mean it's not. It's a fairly well-known sort of whatever unesco site or whatever. So yes, yeah, yeah, it was for me.
[48:57] Keith: It is a unesco world heritage site. Yeah, all right enough of this. Let's move on I don't know if that was interesting or not if people liked that we can do more online dating nonsense. Okay so I'm gonna close meet here and then go back to. Okay.
[49:12] Mike: Okay.
[49:17] Keith: Ah, right shall we get to this face writing thing all right face sitting face writing I guess it's called face sitting is the colloquial term.
[49:21] Mike: Um, yeah, yeah, let's talk about some face sitting wait wait Yeah when you tell wait, you've told me in the past that you say to a woman sit on my face. Do you ever say ride my face.
[49:33] Keith: Now I think sit is the term of art.
[49:37] Mike: I see Okay, you see sit on my face all right, go ahead now.
[49:40] Keith: I should say ride I want them to be more to have more agency all rightpher and says my husband pulls me down more while riding his face. Okay I'm ° ° I'm a 27 year old female and my husband is a 29 year old male love love love to perform oral on each other.
[49:49] Mike: Oh sure.
[50:00] Keith: Just this morning I was writing his face and as I'm doing this is right? He wraps his arm around me and pulls me down further to the point where I panicked and got up of a very large behind and got spooked because I feel like I'm suffocating him I ask him what he was doing and he tells me that he was trying to go deeper with his tongue I then tell him oh okay, well can I land by side then.
[50:10] Mike: Ah.
[50:19] Keith: Tells me no I paused for a second and said okay got back on top seconds later he does it again this time he's groaning loud before I even got a chance to try and perform oral on him. He comes my husband never did this before was wondering is this turning into a suffocation kink I don't watch porn like that but saw people doing what he did on some videos. Sounds like she does watch porn like that I want to talk to him about it but don't want to make him feel a shame for it. I'm down for whatever he likes it I want to please him. So do I say anything or just leave it alone I'm sorry if some of my sentences don't make sense. Well some of your sentences don't make sense. Yeah.
[50:47] Mike: Yeah, yeah.
[50:54] Mike: I mean I would like to leave aside the very large the word vary that used with describing her butt because it's rough. Well let's forget about that. It's not that compelling I think yeah I mean I think that what's going on here is that um men are interested in various forms of penetrating the woman.
[50:59] Keith: I Knew you were going to zoom in on that. Yeah.
[51:10] Mike: And it's arousing to him that he's sort of like yeah I mean guys want to jam things in women's women's vaginas and he's like found a new way to do that and it's arousing. It's a little surprising it sounds like he orgasmed without touching himself which is a little surprising my guess is he was masturbating.
[51:22] Keith: It does She was yeah she was sort of incoherent throughout here. So I'm not sure.
[51:29] Mike: Yeah, um, but I mean is this a behavior that you and I think this is a thing I've done I think I think I can say that I mean it's a like sort of sort of wanting to it. Amps it up a little bit. You're wanting to like penetrate. Basically.
[51:39] Keith: Yeah I wanted to let me read 1 ah other post that was made to Reddit this week. It's super short. How do I how do I as a woman sit on a guy's face.
[51:48] Mike: Sure.
[51:53] Keith: He told me I don't have to worry about suffocating him. However I am worried about hurting him or something help so it hadn't really occurred to me before I read these two things that yeah I think women and I know women have insecurity about face sitting because I think they have to express more agency. And they have various insecurities. But yeah this this concern about suffocating the man seems to be a pretty common one.
[52:19] Mike: They bring that up. But I think yeah I think I think there's also a concern about it's not I don't know if agency but I mean imagine that you imagine that you are with a partner that really liked Anallingus keep performing it on you and you're like okay fine. You can lick my asshole and then she said I want you to sit on my face I think that that would.
[52:33] Keith: Ah.
[52:38] Mike: Create additional concern there be the suffocation concern but there's also like now I'm adopting the position that I adopt when I'm shitting and so it's a little bit like it's it's it's because it's changes The the tone of the situation a little bit over to like wait a minute now this is like this is kind of like an elimination function and it doesn't feel. It feels pretty.
[52:43] Keith: Right.
[52:56] Mike: Dominant but also like it feels fetishy at that point I think that's I think that's not surprising um whereas if a guy is face fucking a woman. It's not like that. It's not vertical. It's more horizontal the motion right? I mean his penis sort of sticks out I have by the way seen a video where a guy is face fucking vertically and it's quite odd because he has to sort of point it Down. Or do pushups or something by the way I just wanted to point out the woman with a very large Derri air here. It's somewhat obvious to me that they were doing this and this is an oft discuss thing for us. They were doing this in the position. The the her facing toward his penis not away from it position. It sound. Yeah, which is not the preferred position at least for you.
[53:26] Keith: Ah.
[53:29] Keith: Yes, oh no, no, no, no, no, no sorry I don't know why you're obsessed with this Mike nobody does it the way you're describing I don't know why you constantly bring this up like I can't tell if you're like trolling me or if it's a joke like.
[53:35] Mike: Ah, you you prefer to have.
[53:41] Mike: Well bit big. But that's the position you would adopt to do 69 and she specifically said that First of all, she had she saw him or hang on. She saw him come. She's she saw him come number 1 and number two. She hadn't yet started sucking on him which strongly suggests.
[53:47] Keith: Nobody does that it's not a thing.
[53:54] Keith: God damage.
[54:04] Mike: That she was going to kind of be able to she wouldn't have seen it if it was behind her back. How.
[54:08] Keith: Like she doesn't say she's sobbed she says he comes now. Ah that doesn't mean that she was like watching it with her own eyes. She just there was evidence that he came so I don't think that.
[54:12] Mike: So I inserted that.
[54:20] Mike: Like people do like people do do it the way I'm describing because that is what 69 is
[54:22] Keith: That he that that she says he can that doesn't prove anything they do, but it's but it's yes, but it's a low. It's a low of most most face sitting face writing encounters are the when the woman.
[54:41] Mike: I hear you I just wanted to bring that up I I think it's I I think it's more I think what I'm describing is more common than you think it is. That's all I think because it because it relates to 69 so it's like yeah okay, okay.
[54:41] Keith: Your faces are facing each other. It's vagina first.
[54:51] Keith: Ok, we're we're going to talk about this for fifteen more seconds and then we're gonna be. We're gonna be done what percentage of of face city experiences. Do you think are asked toward ask first.
[55:03] Mike: do do I have to pick just 1 clarifying question. Do they have to be situations where there is no oral given to the man by the woman while he you know there's no sixteen I just has to be pure face sitting. Okay, then it's going to be like ninety five five or something I I admit that but I'm just saying I think I think in a lot of situations.
[55:11] Keith: Yeah, we're excluding sixty nine s Yes ok all right? We agree.
[55:22] Mike: There's a face sitting component and a sixty nine component and they kind of go back and forth. That's so I think there's another activity there. That's possible. Yeah, so you didn't answer the question of whether you have this tendency also to sort of try to penetrate her more or something like pull her down when you're performing this.
[55:37] Keith: Yeah, it's sort of nice to be I don't know but the word is muzzled muffled like really getting a faceful.
[55:48] Mike: I Just think of it as being more aggressive you're like trying to it's like it's it's penetration. Basically you're trying to yeah ah.
[55:52] Keith: Yeah, yeah, um, okay, well we spent so much time talking about online dating. We only have time for 1 more topic. This person is 19 years old now his girlfriend's 19 years old now. Sorry he's nineteen years old she's 18
[55:58] Mike: Um, sure.
[56:03] Mike: Oh even better.
[56:09] Keith: My girlfriend told her friends I eat strawberries out of harass last week. We started exploring a fantasy. She stuck strawberries in her asshole 1 at a time and I ate the strawberries from harass now we're going to talk about how that's even possible. What she did is tell her friends about this and join them in laughing at my expense.
[56:13] Mike: Time.
[56:28] Keith: Felt okay with her degrading me when it's just the 2 of us. But the way she brought them into the game without asking just rubs me off the wrong way I think just rubs me the wrong way. He's nineteen I said it makes me feel really uncomfortable. But she said she doesn't think she did anything wrong. What do I do? okay.
[56:37] Mike: Rubs. Yeah.
[56:47] Mike: For her.
[56:47] Keith: First of all aren't strawberries like not hard enough to like I would worry they would get in there and then they would get sort of crushed by the sphincter and then it would be a pain to get them out.
[57:00] Mike: Um, I think that's definitely a risk. Yeah, that's not totally I mean I'm going to assume that she sort of they were sort of placed point first kind of in the anus a bit but they weren't actually fully.
[57:08] Keith: And these are like maybe non Gmo strawberries so they're not that big.
[57:15] Mike: Is that our non-gmo one smaller I've grown some pretty big strawberries. Although maybe they were from gmo plants that I bought from Home Depot I don't know it's entirely likely I prefer Monsanto actually? um so yeah I mean that's that's.
[57:18] Keith: Yeah, you got those Monsanto seeds.
[57:31] Mike: Yeah I mean like that That's what I but I mean the the the key point here is that basically he performed he he licked her ass whole as part of this activity and she's making fun of him.
[57:39] Keith: Um I don't think he just lick it. Dude he ate these strawberries that had been up in there.
[57:44] Mike: Ah, yeah I mean but it's a fair point that you're making that there's a they couldn't have been that far up in there because of like if they if if if you said it was in her Vagina I would say that's totally plausible but I don't I would Welcome. Don't send us a video please. But. If a listener wants to try to put a strawberry up their asshole and see if they can do it and keep the strawberry intact like go ahead I Guess ah I think it'd be quite difficult quite difficult.
[58:07] Keith: I would watch a video that a listener sent us for science.
[58:13] Mike: Yeah, your intuition I think is correct here now. The the thing that I wanted to say is that um the I actually am proud of this woman because honestly this is a turnabout is fair play situation I think like men do this all the time. It's very common but particularly young men. Let's say a young man has sex with a woman that is less attractive or whatever he will. They will definitely do like this sort of locker room talk of being a like and then I you know insert. Whatever I I blew my load on her face or whatever like they'll they'll yeah they totally do that and so ah I mean it's not looking never nice to do it to anybody.
[58:38] Keith: Right stop.
[58:46] Keith: Um, yeah.
[58:49] Mike: It's never nice to it to anybody. But that being said like I this is actually I've never really heard of a woman doing that. It's a little hard to believe to be honest because women are usually kind of insecure. So like I could imagine her friend saying well wait. But that means you stuck a strawberry up your asshole would like you.
[59:03] Keith: Yeah, no I'm I'm glad you brought this up that I forgot why I chose this topic but the note I wrote here is yeah what are reasonable expectations around kissing and telling I think that yeah like unfortunately women should just assume.
[59:05] Mike: You're you're at least equally shamed here.
[59:22] Keith: That their male partners are telling their male friends. All kinds of stuff about their performance. That's not all men. But I think a lot of men.
[59:31] Mike: Oh but I mean women do it too. That's why I know that that 1 gentleman has a micro penis that we discuss several episodes back and and there are things like that I mean there are these sort of behavioral things that get discussed so it goes both directions in terms of expectations I don't I mean I don't know I'm not sure there should be that strong.
[59:38] Keith: Right? right.
[59:51] Mike: Expectations I think that that this is one of the things that constrains people from having like kind of insane fetishes like the fact that there is a social dimension to things like if you if you remove the social dimension to everything you can get some pretty anti-social behaviors out of people. Um, and I think men in general. Ah.
[01:00:03] Keith: Um, yeah.
[01:00:10] Mike: Sometimes particularly young men have drives and desires that are pretty pretty antisocial sexually and so you need to constrain it somehow. Um, of course yeah here were most of the kissing and telling is probably the men doing it to the women which is more just kind of mean so I don't know.
[01:00:25] Keith: Yeah, yeah I think yeah, you got to be careful what you do because your partner might tell people and if you ever break up. They're definitely going to tell people the negative stuff in particular.
[01:00:38] Mike: It's I mean I think I think a better policy is just to not care and so it's like I think the best example of course he was the richest man in the world is the Jeff Bezos thing yeah where he he they were going to publish photos of his cock and he's later the woman. Whatever and he said go ahead like please do.
[01:00:43] Keith: That's right. Yeah Jeff Bezos yeah
[01:00:55] Mike: And that's how that that is how I would hope I would respond to that just be like yeah I mean I please do my caucus. Yeah, my cack is awesome. Yeah, like I'll publish them myself if I have to like right like me. Yeah.
[01:00:57] Keith: Yeah, yeah, they tried to blackmail him and he was like I don't care right? Yeah, can you send him to me so I can see him I've been looking for those right.
[01:01:11] Mike: And I think that's I think that's actually if you can accomplish it I Think that's the best strategy of course I realize like you know if you're not independently wealthy. It's hard. It's harder to do that. You might worry about your job and so forth. So.
[01:01:19] Keith: Right? I guess but like if you get canceled for some sexy photos. You can probably sue at least in California.
[01:01:31] Mike: It's a fair point that I mean I have definitely seen in various formums on Reddit cam girls basically saying that it's it. There are so many cam girls now that it of course there's facial recognition software and stuff so but but the argument is being advanced at this point that like it just doesn't mean anything.
[01:01:47] Keith: Right.
[01:01:49] Mike: Like every like some enough ah high enough percentage of of women young women have been cam girls that like it's not disqualifying basically for anything at this point. So yeah, so in some ways it's liberating and go ahead and do it.
[01:01:53] Keith: Right? right? that that's probably true.
[01:02:03] Keith: Yeah I Wonder is it? someone's job to vet the backgrounds of young female applicants like let's say somebody wants to be a supreme Court Justice clerk. Is there somebody who's out there. Scouring the web for skeletons.
[01:02:24] Mike: They're supposed to be but I mean they're supposed to be but I mean I um I I've forgotten his name but there's that New York Congressman who got elected with a completely false resume I mean that's a congressman that's like a pretty elevated position and you and and there any journalist could have published this stuff and and nobody did.
[01:02:33] Keith: Right? right? I know.
[01:02:41] Mike: And so that that gives you an idea like unless you're absolutely at the pinnacle. The absolute apex of something you're probably going to be left alone.
[01:02:44] Keith: I Think that's not quite right I think there was some local newspaper that published some stuff but nobody cared.
[01:02:51] Mike: Okay, but it. But again I mean just shows. So if somebody's applying to a job and they've been a cam girl. Yeah, if you want to be a senator somebody. Maybe it could come out. But even then I mean culture is changing and I think a woman could just say look you know what do you want like I was just making money or something.
[01:03:06] Keith: No I hear Yeah I guess I was just making a joke about the the hype.
[01:03:10] Mike: And actually didn't I the ah the senator from Arizona christian cinema I don't want to get this wrong. But I know she's come out and says she's bisexual and I feel like there's even more there I and I don't want to defame her in any way but like I feel like maybe there may be other things that have come public and she's just like yeah it's true. You know and you okay like whatever.
[01:03:25] Keith: Yeah I mean a big part of her identity is being kooky.
[01:03:30] Mike: Well if you want to call it kooky. But I mean it's also just sort of the way things are in the modern world. They're just people are just more honest about these things I mean look in the ah you know in ancient Rome like there was a lot of it's ah people have always done kooky things. Yeah, so.
[01:03:41] Keith: Yeah, Yeahll right? So That's a wrap on another episode of your mileage may V you can emailil us at Y M Mv Potted Gmail Dot Com We pay $10 for feedback. We really like feedback, especially negative feedback so that we can try to get better. Um, you can also also send questions there. We Thank you for your time and we look forward to catching you next time on your mileage may vary.

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Episode 118: Dating App Technologies, Vibrator Emasculation, Pulling Her Down, Eating And Telling

Episode Transcript