Your Mileage May Vary: Small Sex Dolls, Vulva Color, Resensitization, Best Sex Partner Ever

Episode Transcript

Transcript automatically generated by a robot. Apologies for any inaccuracies.

[00:00] Keith: Hello and welcome to your mileage may vary. We talk about sex and relationships with frankness that is mostly in good faith but often controversial we have a fun list of topics to cover on today's show including a new reason for premature ejaculation lying about 1 ne's body count vulva color and more I am Keith. My co-host is Mike how is my microphone mike.
[00:22] Mike: It sounds okay you as with you're not using like the professional mic right now because you're in Los Angeles as I take it and on a trip and that. Ah yeah, you can always hear a little echo or background or something surprisingly.
[00:25] Keith: Now.
[00:33] Keith: Yeah I fled the bay area to get away from the wildfire smoke and when I discovered that it was smokey outside I bought a plane I bought a flight that was leaving within like 2 hours so I packed very hastily and forgot to pack my travel mic.
[00:48] Mike: And this is this is because you wanted to go to Los Angeles to be able to exercise and also just have a nice life there. Not venome to get it get out of the nonsense.
[00:57] Keith: Um, right? Yeah I didn't want to deal with the smoke and I'm trying to run ninety miles this week and so I had to get out of dodge.
[01:03] Mike: Um, you have to get out there and run pretty soon unless you already did today I don't know maybe you're doubling today. So the yeah yeah, the the wildfire smoke thing for the bay area is relatively new I mean of course it's historically not new, but.
[01:11] Keith: I did I right.
[01:21] Mike: Um, in the last say thirty years there wasn't that much and then all of a sudden you had a spate of it that some people attribute to the utility company not doing deferred maintenance under their power lines. Ah some people you know? of course there are people that are going to say it's global warming etc. It could just be luck. Also um.
[01:30] Keith: Aha.
[01:35] Keith: Um, ah.
[01:39] Mike: Ah, the first time it happened in this most recent spate which was maybe five or six years ago before covid I did a lot of running with a mask on and that was one of the ways when covid happened I knew a lot more about using n nine five masks than your average fellow. Um, and.
[01:53] Keith: Um, yeah.
[01:58] Mike: Yeah, it's 1 way like I had sort of made it made the basque conversation even more irritating for me because people would make you know these claims and I'd say well it's just like there's a bunch of problems with it. You're saying because of having that experience I'm sure people that work in healthcare. Obviously I have a lot of experience with those things as well or maybe people in construction. So.
[02:16] Keith: Um, yeah I think California is probably 1 of the few remaining places where there's still bastions of people frequently wearing masks I ran along the strand today that goes between Manhattan beach and I think rodondo beach or Torrance Beach and you know it's like this paved path that goes for miles and miles with these expensive houses where presumably in the afternoon and evenings people just sit down in the patios and invite women to come in. Ah but in the mornings it's mostly walkers and exercisers and yeah I would say.
[02:47] Mike: That's right? so.
[02:55] Keith: 2 out of 10 people are still wearing masks of some some kind a lot of them. Yes, yeah.
[02:58] Mike: While walking down the beach. So. There's no, um, there's no scientific evidence whatsoever that that does anything I mean I think I think you could actually make the argument that it's around even whether it helps or hurts you in terms of I Assume they're worried about Covid. Either're outdoors. There's plenty of air movement. They're creating a little space around their mouth without air Movement. So They're cool and let's apart and virus gets in there and then they're trapping it around their mouth. Um, yeah.
[03:17] Keith: Presumably Yeah, right.
[03:26] Keith: Well a lot of them are wearing cloth masks or surgical masks and not n 95 which also implies some confusion. Well there was a time when I was wearing masks a lot particularly in enclosed spaces.
[03:31] Mike: Right? And nobody right.
[03:46] Keith: Um, there was a time when I was probably wearing cloth masks before it became clear that those were basically worthless and if you were going to wear maskscus may as well wear an n 95 and I mean there were times when like the well-motivated intelligent person could be confused about this. But I think that time has passed I think. Outdoor cloth mask wearing is probably not effective.
[04:10] Mike: Yeah, and the only thing I would say to add to that is I think that in fact, a motivated diligent person should not have been able to be confused about that in 2020. It's just that there was a concerted effort by the powers that be to make it difficult to get accurate information. There. There have been studies going back. Quite some distance that ah you have to be pretty.. It's pretty hard to stop Airborne Viral transmission. It's very difficult. It's on him. It's It's not impossible. It's just very Challenging. You probably need sort of Scuba diving equipment.
[04:41] Keith: Um, yeah I don't remember the specifics of the time I'm not willing to completely concede that point I think there was a time when the science was confusing but we're all already going to get some emails about this. So let's move on. Let's talk about sex. Um I was watching a porn today or last night.
[04:46] Mike: Sure That's fine.
[04:53] Mike: Um, yeah.
[04:58] Keith: Guess it was I was writing this morning ah last night and it was a man in the missionary position on top of a woman and he put his fist and was using it to apply pressure. Ah, below her navel even maybe below her panty line but above her pubic bone I guess um and I think he was doing it. Ah so that maybe she would feel.
[05:20] Mike: Um, sure.
[05:33] Keith: The head of his cock a bit more profoundly or something can you speculate why he was doing that.
[05:38] Mike: Um, there so there are um, a couple things. Um, there's some, there's some. There's a guy a couple really that make porn they make vr porn as well. They're called Jack and Jill and I've mentioned them on the podcast before.
[05:53] Keith: Um, in here.
[05:54] Mike: And they often have like threesomes and foursomes with other people. The guy has a very very long penis and he long long is the important part here. Yeah, it's big but I but it's big, but the note it's not a pencil. The notable thing that makes you.
[06:01] Keith: Um, you're saying you said long, not big. Is it Well I mean you don't want a pencil. Okay okay, all sorry continue.
[06:14] Mike: So it's surprising about it as its length and um, they he they have several videos where he where he you can see the outline of it or whatever you can see it in that area of the woman's body as he's penetrating her and in a couple of them I dare say that the woman is receiving it.
[06:26] Keith: Um, yes.
[06:32] Mike: Get some amount of pleasure or some sort of sensation out of that experience. So She's sort of like surprised in a positive way and like maybe I think I'll remember 1 where she's pushing in that area to sort of like increase the amount of stimulation there. Um, and then I've also definitely read that this yeah I mean there there it can be stimulative and I think it's. Analogous Maybe or so on the order of G Spot stimulation. Although I guess you would say its it should be too deep for that right? so.
[06:57] Keith: Um, yeah, my guess is that they're angling in it such a way that it doesn't hit the cervix I Guess it's I don't know if above is the right word here. But yeah, it's angled in such a way so it's not hitting the cervix and.
[07:02] Mike: Yes. Yeah, So it's the words. The words you would use here are anterior and posterior so you can remember it because Posterior is towards your ass. So You know your your posterior anterior is towards your belly button and there's an area called yeah, there's the anterior fornix which is like sort of the if the cervix is like a little.
[07:13] Keith: If yeah here we go. Ah okay so it's anterior to the cervix.
[07:27] Mike: Jar the top of a lid of a jar or something that juts out into the vagina then you get be getting sort of going around that to the back and there's like kind of a pouch there that goes all the way around and if in the anterior one can be sensitive I think some people call it the a spot. Um, so so it's going to be that.
[07:30] Keith: Are.
[07:39] Keith: Okay, so it's between the cervix and wherever the G spot is right? It's the underside.
[07:45] Mike: Well the G spot is much closer to the entrance because the G spot is really just the the clitorteris that's available on the other on exactly so this is going to be much deeper than that and I think it would sort of have to be that. That's why I said it's sort of it's like the G spot but it's not really, it couldn't really be that same structure.
[08:03] Keith: Um, no I don't think it could because you're it's too. Yeah, it's too deep as you say.
[08:03] Mike: I Think yeah.
[08:12] Mike: Honestly, a guy putting his fist in there I could see doing it for his own pleasure because he can then feel. It's kind of hot Actually right? I mean like you can feel your own hand through her belly to your.
[08:23] Keith: Um, yeah, yeah, maybe that's what he was doing now that you mention it.
[08:27] Mike: And if you if you trapped it if you really pushed hard. You could maybe trap the penis between your fist and her spinal cord her vertebrae and then really get a really tight grip inside I doubt that you do that with in a safe way. There's too many organs in there and so forth too many intestines and Kidneys and.
[08:40] Keith: Yeah I don't think that's possible. Yeah, and you're talking about the other direction there that would be posterior of the cervix. How I see I see I see.
[08:46] Mike: Ah, probably not.
[08:51] Mike: Well, you'd be pushing down your penis so far that like it's sort of it but pushing down the vagina so far that sort of mashes it down and tightens it around this. This is not what's happening This is just ah yeah, this is just sort of a more sensation thing.
[08:59] Keith: No, it's not no yeah, it looked I mean the amount of pressure he was applying looked a bit uncomfortable but she seemed to be tolerating it nay enjoying it. Yeah.
[09:13] Mike: If you applied I mean if you applied that kind of pressure to your own abdomen I don't think it would hurt you you could go pretty far. Yeah, there's just not any structures that are that sensitive. Um I have something else to bring up quickly. Um.
[09:19] Keith: Pretty strong there. Yeah, that's true right? I'm ready.
[09:29] Mike: So I found a porn that was a man fucking a real doll it was I don't know if it was exactly a real doll but it it was pretty realistic looking. Why don't you describe it. Go ahead.
[09:33] Keith: Um, okay.
[09:38] Keith: Do people know what? a real doll is I do but okay, it's It's a sex doll it is life-sized and it has holes that you can that you can penetrate right? So it has a vagina does it have an anus.
[09:55] Mike: Um, yes.
[09:56] Keith: Think it does yeah and it has a mouthful and they're meant to be quite realistic looking and feeling I don't know what materials they use but they're expensive. What are they probably North Of A Thousand maybe they can even be north of ten thousand
[10:08] Mike: Yeah I looked it up and it looked like a typical one might be the 5 to $7000 range to quite expensive. Well quite expensive for a normal person anyway, I'd imagine I'd imagine. Yeah.
[10:13] Keith: Okay, all right, not for you. Of course you can customize hair color and skin color and probably eye color and the like and you know they look a little creepy. They're a little bit memed for being you know a toy of the of the.
[10:24] Mike: Sure.
[10:34] Keith: Exceptionally rich and exceptionally depraved for them. That's that the reputation real adults have.
[10:35] Mike: Um, sure. So ah, so let me just say 1 other thing before getting the meat of this first of all a friend of the show looked it up and he was able to find one. It was. It wasn't that it was child sized. It was a real doll that was child sized this is important but it was ah it it was just a scaled down adult so it was not actually so I do actually have a question in my mind I'm not sure if it's easy to talk about though like what are the ethics and morals around if it actually were like do you think someone could say.
[10:50] Keith: Oh no, yeah.
[11:09] Mike: And't even know if you could legally sell one that was a child like an an actual child real doll. So I be be curious about that.
[11:09] Keith: Um, right? Yeah, we've we've skirded around this ah ah bit in the past like ah with all these generative Ai tools that can make images. Can you ask it to draw child pornography is that out of bounds and we've ah.
[11:25] Mike: I'm sure you could.
[11:28] Keith: Ah, well I think they have barricades and guardrails up that won't that if you asked that it'll tell you no, but certainly at openai headquarters you could use dolly 3 which I believe is released yesterday or is about to be released um to to actually do this and. And I think we talked about this on this show before like my official position on this is I don't know if it is the case that indulging child pornography fantasies using child porn makes you more likely to actually commit crimes and act out on it then. Maybe these things should be legal. Ah if it's the case that having access to this kind of stuff makes you less likely because you're having your your needs indulged without actually going out and seeking children then I guess I'm sort of for it. But there's some ratios there and like I'm not sure.
[12:09] Mike: Um.
[12:23] Keith: How would you even study such a thing. Um I'm not sure.
[12:24] Mike: Short let me let me ask this? Let's let's say that there was such a generative. We can get back to the real dollar segment. Let's say let's say there was such a generative Ai tool and it was uncensored there so there surely will be uncensored ones eventually and and imagine that it creates a video like I say a short.
[12:33] Keith: Um, yes, yeah.
[12:40] Mike: Thirty second clip that might be posted on the subreddit and there's a slider where you can change the age of the woman. What is your intuition not about you personally, but about the average man or the median man.
[12:46] Keith: Right.
[12:55] Mike: What is the age. He'd have to take that slider down to when he would be like yeah I'm not this isn't arousing to me anymore.
[13:00] Keith: I don't like this question I thought you you, you've attempted to abstract it from me but 1 can't really answer it without implicating themselves.
[13:05] Mike: Um, it's surely under 18 right.
[13:10] Mike: All right? Well so I think that I think that it's a little bit problematic because I'm certain that the number would be under eighteen I don't know what the age would be and I think it would vary by person. But I bet it would be kind of a bell curve.
[13:22] Keith: Um, you should you should restate just because we always get in trouble on this kind of stuff. Yeah, the hypothetical is yeah what point would the man cease having any sexual attraction. They'd be. They'd be actually like repulsed or annoyed.
[13:35] Mike: You know we stipulate the right almost no men would be attracted to if if if you switched to a two year old I'm not even sure how the thing would make that computer generated video but there's a age where where I'm assuming that it essentially be nobody but I know it wouldn't be nobody which is really sad but it would be almost nobody.
[13:45] Keith: So yeah.
[13:55] Mike: But yeah, but obviously the actual the interesting action would be say between age I don't know 10 and 18 or something they're somewhere in there for for each man. They're going to typically and it's probably a bell curve around some age at which they say okay I I tap out now in terms of interest and in that sense I could see.
[13:59] Keith: Alright, yeah.
[14:07] Keith: Um, right.
[14:13] Mike: Being some danger in that because it basically would allow a man to figure out. Oh I really like fifteen year olds and that's not great. You know it's sort of better to not have that information.
[14:21] Keith: Um, do you think men don't know that already maybe that even as I asked the question you may be right like because it's so impossible to even engage with the question or so difficult to engage with the question people might.
[14:26] Mike: Yeah, and um.
[14:36] Mike: I think yeah yeah I think it can be confusing for a guy like I think that this is one of the things that makes this topic intri sort of fraud is I think if it can be difficult for a guy to even tell what age someone is oh she's obviously 13 It's like really like not clear and especially in a society that.
[14:38] Keith: Just assume that like they're not interested below 22 or whatever. But that's not the reality.
[14:51] Keith: Um, yeah.
[14:55] Mike: You know where women try to look as young as possible make up. Ah you know all correction of video correction I mean where they actually correct images and so forth and as part of movies and so forth. Um, yeah I mean so for a guy it's like why I don't actually so if you say what does a 13 year old look like I'm not totally sure like so this would be a way to.
[15:04] Keith: Um, yeah.
[15:13] Keith: Right? Yeah I don't know. But yeah I mean I guess I'm just a consequentialist on this right? I don't know what the right policies around child pornography are but I do think it should be special cased.
[15:13] Mike: Get sure about it which then could be problematic. Yeah um, ah.
[15:30] Keith: Like there's other things that I'm not a consequentialist on like I think that there should be freedom of speech generally, but this is a special case.
[15:39] Mike: And you would feel the same way about a child real doll.
[15:45] Keith: Ah, yes, yeah, So if if the research showed that giving pedophiles access to real dolls that were children made them less likely to commit actual crime Then. I would be in favor and if it showed the opposite I would not be in favor.
[16:01] Mike: Um, okay so let's set aside the the the Si let's assume it's an adult women woman. What I was impressed by in this porn is that like I it wasn't repulsive to me I think that I could see.
[16:15] Mike: I mean I I think that the way that that it moved was realistic enough that I think that this could work and this friend of the show I talked to about it said he really thought that if there was like a vr headset may. Ah so let me say an augmented reality headset like the forthcoming Apple product that basically would put features on like facial features on the doll. So that you see her as like it seems like she's real and there was a voice and stuff like that he thought that setting aside the vaca you would have to clean it after the act and so forth like he could imagine. He could very well imagine that like being able to suspend disbelief and that working for him.
[16:35] Keith: Um, sure. Yeah.
[16:49] Keith: Better than actual sex.
[16:52] Mike: No, just being equivalent or like you know it's not he says look you know then I don't have to go on dates I can just fuck this thing.
[16:59] Keith: Right? Well I mean look we've we've talked about this before too. There's lots of men who already prefer masturbating to sex or at least prefer masturbating to the effort. It takes to go out and have you know actual sex I think particularly in Japan. It gets talked about a lot there. Where perhaps not coincidentally I think that's where most sex dolls are sold.
[17:24] Mike: That makes sense. They've also got futenari there which I think is their version of Trans women I don't know I think I think it's the Japanese Trans women I can check.
[17:27] Keith: What is futenari.
[17:38] Keith: Um, there's all kinds of phraseology in anime it's from anime. Yeah.
[17:42] Mike: It's a female or female looking Hermaphrodite Character. So I think it actually comes from car cartoons. Yeah there you go? well but there are women I've seen porn where like it's an actual woman who is you know so to speak a futunari her maphrodite. That's interesting so you can. Take your pick of the genitals. Interesting. Yes.
[17:59] Keith: Yeah, as you know I occasionally look at anime porn and these sites often have checkboxes when you search and I know that I knew that futenari was one of them and I knew it was one of the ones that I didn't want to have checked but I I did that.
[18:09] Mike: So.
[18:14] Mike: Oh you uncheck that one and that's do you uncheck it because you've haven't played with it or because it you find it problematic.
[18:18] Keith: And forgotten what it is. I don't remember I just know that in my mind I knew that I I didn't like fruit Tanari there's other there's other ones too. There's something called I think each e c c h I that no I think that's.
[18:27] Mike: Okay.
[18:34] Mike: And that's when you do check I assume.
[18:41] Keith: Ah know. Okay, that doesn't sound so bad. Each is a slang term the Japanese language for playfully sexual actions is an adjective who is used with the meaning of sexy dirty or naughty. Okay, that sounds fine I don't I don't like.
[18:52] Mike: But Futerinari is a step too far. You don't want a true hermaphrodite. It's so great though I mean you just sort of lift up those balls and there's another it just keeps going Now you have a vagina.
[18:59] Keith: Right? That's not.
[19:03] Keith: Yeah I would rather not have to displace a penis to access the vagina generally.
[19:13] Mike: Yeah, so okay, that's interesting. So if there was a really really attractive woman who had a normal ah sorry ah ah she was born with the vagina but she also had like a penis you just that's no yeah I think I write I'm I think I'm with you on that? yeah.
[19:22] Keith: Um I think yeah I think so I can't know until I'm in that situation but like generally that sounds disgusting to me so I don't know but there's a lot of porn that plays around that edge of like.
[19:31] Mike: Yeah.
[19:39] Keith: Yeah people with both sexual organs and yeah I don't love that either is she still live.
[19:40] Mike: Yeah, there's also the giant clit porn from the like the like China the wrestler and so forth. Yeah, not. It's not great anyway. Okay I have no idea she probably had a royd rage incident.
[19:55] Keith: Yeah, may have um, all right should we move on or do you want to say anything else about this weird small sex to.
[19:58] Mike: Um, yeah, no, the weird the small one was very strange I mean a small adult I mean maybe it's just cheaper less material. But yeah, but who wants to have sex with a one foot tall woman.
[20:06] Keith: Um I guess is that? yeah, it's ah it's less expensive.
[20:15] Mike: Was really weird looking.
[20:16] Keith: Um, well, you're saving the money you know and also there's like a physical space thing like I saw some Tv show. Oh it's called Dave um, it's about a rapper and anyway he buys a real doll and I think there's a scene where.
[20:34] Keith: He's like trying to figure out where to put it when he's not using it like you just put in your gloss it or leave it in the corner of your bedroom I mean it's It's huge. It's human size. So what do you do.
[20:42] Mike: I feel like you could dig out. You could dig out part of your mattress kind of I'm imagining the the bible at the end of the Shawshank redemption where like ah he so gives the note to the war and the like salvation lay within this is the same thing you have like a a hollow cut out of your bed and your salvation is down in there. That's the real doll.
[20:50] Keith: Ah, the f.
[20:59] Keith: But they would affect.
[21:00] Mike: That's her hiding place and say you go to bed at night and you roll over and dig her out and then put her back know.
[21:06] Keith: Ah, yeah, you need like a little secret compartment I the shame of having a real doll exceeds I don't want 1 generally like I've tried using various masturbation tools like the ah. What's the famous 1 Oh the flashlight and what I have tried a flashlight and I also tried the ah it's fine. It was the same with the tenga egg that a few xes ago gave me.
[21:25] Mike: I Didn't think you'd try to flashlight. You've tried a flashlight and it didn't work for you. Wait wait what happened because you haven't revealed this before what happened with the flashlight. Oh Taga you yeah you talked about that but the flashlight was not better than beating off with your hand.
[21:47] Keith: Um, it's different and it's so much more work and I and I think for me, it's sort of saddled by an extra sense of feeling lame like it just.
[21:59] Mike: Okay, yeah, they should try giving um apes in the zoo flashlights and seeing if they're willing to do that or you know various toys and see if they're willing to or if they just say Nah I can't.
[22:00] Keith: Like having to get out like all these equipment to Master pitch is feels sort of sad. Ah, and.
[22:15] Mike: You know if they have the same reaction. You do like now I'm just using my hand bro. Yeah.
[22:15] Keith: Um, yeah, yeah, yeah I threw away and I used the flashlight I think I just used it once I think I was like I don't even want to clean this? Yeah, what am I going to give it to goodwill. Yeah I think you were to say that.
[22:28] Mike: You threw it away. You should have at least like donated it I think ah well you live I mean you live in San Francisco right I'm sure there's a ah person on um person experiencing homelessness that would appreciate that toy.
[22:34] Keith: But but would buy sex toys from goodwill.
[22:45] Keith: Um, ah in in concept start to think of a ah less desirable like something with shit on it or like yeah like.
[22:46] Mike: Just be like we used once needs washing.
[23:00] Keith: Like I don't know if there's there's some joke here but I'm I'm not reaching it all right? Let's move on this person says I a 32 year old male came quickly twice when fucking my wife without a condom.
[23:01] Mike: Yeah.
[23:13] Keith: Ah, me and my wife have been married for five years now sexually active for 10 our preferred mode of contraception is the condom. It always has been usually our romp in the bed lasts for around 10 to 20 minutes of penetrative sacks with the condom on today. Decided to do it without a condom which we haven't done in years. We got caught up in the moment and she asked me to fuck her without one and I wasn't about to turn that off her down I don't know if that was yeah yeah, hear back from him in ah in a month. It felt fucking amazing.
[23:36] Mike: He's gonna have a really fun next eighteen years gone
[23:43] Keith: On our first round we both came in like 5 minutes both came in like yeah, okay but I didn't think much of it an hour later we fucked again and usually I last pretty long the second time around. But this time I came almost just as quickly as I had earlier a word if using a condom for so long has made me so sensitive that I just can't last when I'm not wearing one.
[23:46] Mike: Both um.
[24:02] Keith: Okay, so this is the opposite of depth grip. He has been wearing the condom for so long that when he removes that desensitizing effect of the condom. He now is coming too quickly. How long would you expect.
[24:05] Mike: Yes.
[24:20] Keith: This effect to last.
[24:24] Mike: That's a good question I mean um, not long, not long I would expect it to be weeks depends on how often he has sex but not you not that often I mean I think it's the same thing for death group like it's pretty quickly reversible Actually um.
[24:31] Keith: Um, yeah, of course of course.
[24:42] Mike: Because the yeah, it's an interesting question. What is the actual physical process. Yep.
[24:44] Keith: Um, I bet my intuition and the reason why I wanted to talk about this is my intuition is removing the condom and increasing the sensation goes away pretty quickly but death Grip takes takes longer like because.
[24:53] Mike: Yeah, and why do you have that intuition.
[25:01] Keith: I Just feel like once you've gotten used to a more a higher pressure thing you're I think why is more pressure.
[25:14] Mike: I mean let's say you've had so you've had ah a broken limb before maybe you haven't you know? Ah so when you have a cast on all so that say it's 4 to six weeks or something already. It's pretty weird when you take it off because the the nerves aren't used to.
[25:18] Keith: Now I have not um.
[25:31] Mike: Ah, the sensation right? So that's already. Okay, maybe there's some equivalent I don't I'm not sure but generally it. Yeah I'm I'm skeptical that something would take longer than weeks to than a few weeks to.
[25:32] Keith: Um, yeah, presumably I've never been through this I don't know I'm getting braces off or something I went through that.
[25:50] Mike: Kind of regrow in terms of a sensation because ultimately I think it's just your body up or downregulating the yeah the importance of the the neurons.
[25:53] Keith: Um, yeah, now that you mentioned this I think you're right? Well Okay, okay, maybe this is a good analogy. Let's say that ah you get you could right? and well yeah, but even that would.
[26:03] Mike: He could have a callous go ahead. Um, do you have any? do you have callouss on your cock have you ever had a callous on your cock not to your knowledge that's different I mean something for like where where there's actually thick physical thickening and see although I've I've read.
[26:11] Keith: Eventually go away. No no I have had and an abrasion wound.
[26:28] Keith: Um, is that possible on penis skin a callous.
[26:28] Mike: People always use this word. Okay, so okay, yeah, people say that if you're circumcised the head of your penis becomes and the word they uses Keratinized this is always the word that's used with it. It must be like some medical textbook said this and then everybody copies it in their blogs and.
[26:39] Keith: Okay. Yeah, Okay, yeah, yeah.
[26:47] Mike: Reddit posts and everything and so um, yeah, so part of what guys who are trying to uncircumcise themselves like these guys who like will hang weights from their what's left of their 4 skin to get it to grow out which does work eventually or they' like duct tape it so that it's kind of pulled taut all the time.
[27:04] Keith: Um, it works I don't I think it works in a way like when a woman gets pregnant it sort of like stretches the skin but like that extra skin is different than the extra skin would have been if they were born that way. So it's like still inferior. Even if you can stretch it out.
[27:05] Mike: Part of what they do.
[27:21] Mike: That's true, but but you see that you have to understand the goal. So yeah, they they know they're never going to get sensation back and therefore skin the way it would have been if they were intact but the thing they can do is just so so you definitely can grow skin and and evidence for that is that ah with burn patients and when they need to get. Skin transplants What they'll do is they'll put little a balloon under the skin and blow it up and in a certain area of the body and it will actually produce more skin so you can definitely do that And so the the premise here is not that you'll get lots of sensation out of that skin. The premise is then you will have skin covering the head of your penis which will cause it to decharatinize over time.
[27:42] Keith: Um, yeah.
[27:57] Mike: Become more sensitive less layers of skin over them those ah you know those neurons you want or whatever nerves you want to rub against her pussy trying to get it all out there. Okay, so so anyway so that ah so that you do have.
[27:57] Keith: Um, I said I said.
[28:02] Keith: Nervous. So yeah.
[28:15] Mike: But there is some like quote unquote damage or callousing or something that you certainly do have I'm just skeptical that that no is just from living your life and having your penis in your underwear and pants and stuff rubbing around. You know, not covered by skin just like if you took a woman and you and you.
[28:21] Keith: Um, well for masturbating you mean.
[28:25] Keith: Um, yeah, right? sure.
[28:32] Mike: Remove the hood of her clitoris like her clit would eventually become sort of covered in ah an extra rough layer of skin because that's just what skin does. Um, so anyway that that would take longer to go away I'm pretty sure it's skin.
[28:36] Keith: Um, sure. Yeah, although is the clitoris skin or some other kind of tissue.
[28:49] Mike: I Mean it's It's like it's like asking if your gums or skin. Yeah, it's a mucus Membrane or whatever. But ah, but your yeah I mean it's obviously the um penis head of your penis and a woman's clitoris are sort of the same structure so you could make the head of your penis.
[28:50] Keith: Um, it's it's game like yeah sure. Yeah.
[29:06] Keith: Um.
[29:08] Mike: And I mean not I've never interacted with an uncircumcised man's penis head but in porn you can see that they're much softer more supple. Yeah, it's pretty pretty different.
[29:15] Keith: Um, they seem like it. Yeah, it's like a little delicate flower under there.
[29:22] Mike: Yeah, it makes it's the 1 thing actually it's it's one of the few things that makes me kind of want to go to a bathhouse is to to see one of those little little ripe strawberries that that. Ah, um, anyway, but that's but I'm skeptical that that would that that.
[29:28] Keith: To examine to see one live in the extra flesh.
[29:39] Mike: Would change based on masturbation I'm skeptical that you would get more or less keratonizing depending on his masturbation I think it's much more likely just to be kind of like the way your brain interprets the signals. Yeah.
[29:47] Keith: Um, maybe maybe the analogy I was going to make is let's say you get a massage twice a week and um, you're used to getting. Really really really rough massage like you know, strong hands Deep tissue. Whatever and then they say Okay, we're going to stop doing that We're going to suddenly give you you know I don't know what's a really light massage.
[30:19] Mike: I Don't is there one I mean I guess just like usually it's like there's deep tissue and then there's regular so regular I Guess you're used to deep tissue and they're moving back to regular.
[30:21] Keith: I Don't know. Yeah, yeah, right? Yeah then and you know you can say whether you want like small medium or light pressure so or small medium hard.
[30:37] Mike: There you go.
[30:37] Keith: Light medium or hard and yeah, so they're using some light massage technique now is I feel like you might get stuck on like wanting the hard one in a way that if you went the other way so you'd always gotten light massage and now you're getting heavy I think you could like get used to the heavy thing more quickly. But I don't know. Maybe even that analogy is wrong. I'm not sure.
[31:00] Mike: Um, that's interesting. Yeah I don't know I mean the only way to do that would probably be through an experiment. Um.
[31:04] Keith: Well that you could experiment with the ah the sex experiments are hard because you got to get the study approved by the university that's tricky but massage. You know people would sign up to say like oh yeah yeah I want to get like 20 massages in one way and then it's going to switch to 10 the other way and.
[31:09] Mike: Fair point fair point.
[31:20] Mike: Right? I do agree with this guy in general that if you are used to a condom and you switch to an audit condom. It's kind of a revelatory experience that then does go away goes away kind of quickly right? I mean for a while in my experience can be only a few minutes and then.
[31:21] Keith: I Don't know how you set it up exactly.
[31:30] Keith: Um, oh I'm sure it's awesome for for a while? Yeah, um.
[31:37] Keith: Well in this guy's experience. It was even less it sounds like came came quickly twice. Yeah, all right? Let's move on. He doesn't specify. But I think we could assume she didn't.
[31:40] Mike: Down regulates. It was like nine nine and a half seconds yeah and the woman came the the woman came the first time but not the second time.
[31:56] Keith: Orgasm and either time.
[31:57] Mike: I'm going to guess she orgasm the second time but not the first time and he just has no idea how to interpret her behaviors. He doesn't her coming has nothing to do with him coming. Well maybe not I don't know.
[32:01] Keith: Um, maybe although we came just as quickly the second time as the first. So.
[32:09] Keith: I Mean there there there's correlation but not causality.
[32:13] Mike: Have I've searched for it by the way on various porn sites for simultaneous orgasm porn and there isn't any. There's isn't any I know because it's easy to fake right? The the thing you'll find Okay, if you search for this. Go ahead.
[32:24] Keith: Um, that doesn't seem right really picking a note.
[32:31] Mike: If you search for this what you'll find is it? Okay, it'll be and I guess it's because they look I don't know why they do it this way. But what you'll find is a woman masturbating and a guy sort of hovering over her with his penis masturbating and then when she starts to orgasm he nuts on her face. Which is kind of funny. It's like I'm not sure I think maybe some women would be like oh this is amping it up but I actually suspect that when you're experiencing the orgasm like you started orgasming having somebody not on your face then it doesn't make it better I think it would have to happen like 10 seconds before and then it would maybe amp up the experience. But after it's I think it's just lame I think it's basically like he waits till she orgasms and he like throws a yogurt at her and gets sort of her experience of it. It's just hurting her. You know.
[33:18] Keith: Good analogy that was good I don't have a strong opinion on when the right time to apply nut to the faces in terms of apping up. Ah at Orgasm I would think that both women.
[33:26] Mike: Sure.
[33:34] Keith: Are mostly pretending that they like that in the first place. But I think that.
[33:38] Mike: It's believable that these to me that they these could be simultaneous because the woman is masturbating with say a vibbrator with her fingers or whatever. So it's so it is I think that's probably it's real. Um, but that. But interestingly it's. Yeah, finding that of course when you're searching for simultaneous orgasm the thing everybody's searching for if you search for that is like 2 people in the missionary position and like she starts to come and then he does to or vice for whatever something along those lines and like I actually have not found that which is interesting because it's easy to fake like I said finding it real might not.
[34:05] Keith: Right.
[34:10] Mike: Exist but it might not exist in real life either might be fake in real life too. Anyway.
[34:14] Keith: Um, yeah, all right? Let's move on. Ah I think we we danced around this topic a few episodes ago but I don't think I read this thing if I di a light edit it out. It goes. Fiance is asking questions about my sex life I don't want to lie but I need to know the best way to answer honestly without hurting him. My fiance has been trying to get me to tell him he is the best lover I've ever had from a purely physical sexual chemistry. This isn't exactly the case. Course I Love sex with him so much I'm going to commit to sex with him and only him for the rest of my life. We have a very active sex life and we both have a lot of fun. Ah, that's enough for me fun loving sex is all I want in a relationship I've had amazing sex before and it's not really all that I'd much rather have my fiancee who is good in bed and an amazing man and partner. Be with the guy who I would say I was best sexually with who was an immature borderline Alcoholic douchebag who only wanted to see me when we were going to have sex amazing sexual chemistry and physical compatibility means nothing to me if every hookup leaves me feeling used After. Ah, okay, so obviously we have discussed.
[35:14] Mike: I Don't think we've discussed this before go ahead and yeah, no.
[35:20] Keith: Yeah I Don't think we've done this particular topic though. So Obviously I can't tell him in this way I know how boys are I know this would shatter his ego and change our relationship forever. The other thing is I don't want to lie to him I want to tell him the complete truth to me. It feels more disrespectful to placate him and lie to him about this. Ask me if he's the best I've been telling him that I don't compare sexual partners which I don't typically do and that I love having sex with him which leads to more probing questions which I do my best to dodge I'm unsure of what the best way to give him an honest answer is yeah.
[35:48] Mike: Well, he knows what that means I mean that's not the only answer that he she could give that would shut him up is like you know I thought about it and you are the best that you she could fix it. Ah after having given that other answer she could say yeah I just wasn't ready for the question I had to think about it.
[35:55] Keith: Right.
[36:07] Mike: And he'd probably believe her.
[36:08] Keith: Um, do you think there's any I mean you and I have both talked about like radical honesty and I told you about Sam Harris's book lying I don't know if you've read it yet, but it talks about various situations. Ah. Where you should lie one that comes up in the book is the nazis come to your door and say where are you hiding the jews you know, do you do lie or do you um tell them they're in the attic and ah.
[36:40] Mike: Wait. What's the right I mean obviously the right thing to do is just to just to tell them where they are But what's the what's the wrong thing.
[36:46] Keith: Um, the the book goes into ah reasons why it might actually be better to be honest there like if you lie and then they go to like the next door neighbor and then kill the neighbor because they think he's lying.
[36:56] Mike: Right.
[37:01] Keith: Right? Like you're you're you're basically like just pushing the issue downstream and there could be negative consequences to that? um.
[37:08] Mike: Um, this is really hard for me to understand because it's at the call at the heart of this reasoning is some kind of I guess bleeding heart thing where it's like so the way that I'm supposed to evaluate this question is.
[37:24] Mike: But how many other people are hurt I can't in other words I'm not allowed to consider whether I'm going to be hurt. Okay, well I mean if I turn if I So yeah, anyway, it's this isn't that interesting, but the I wouldn't be worried about the neighbor getting killed I worry about the way neighbor ratting me out and then I get killed. That's why I would why I would hand them over.
[37:29] Keith: Um, now you can consider your own.
[37:39] Keith: Um, sure. Yeah.
[37:43] Mike: Be like oh well, you're going to find this out anyway. So whatever. So I might as well do it in the way that gets me out of this probably you know.
[37:52] Keith: Yeah I mean the details of the hypothetical are important and I don't remember them well enough to to argue here. But in any case, ah this might be an example of a time where really the best thing for everyone is just a lie. Um.
[37:54] Mike: Okay.
[38:10] Mike: Um, the thing that I would yeah.
[38:10] Keith: It depends on the man I think and it depends on like ideally you would have communicated various sexual thoughts and and wishes and desires and problems in the past and So. Revealing to him that he's not the best ever wouldn't be this like crushing blow. But if you haven't and you generally don't have good communication patterns then um, yeah, lying here might be the way to go.
[38:41] Mike: Um, yeah I mean the thing that I would worry about in this situation is what I don't think first of all I don't think it's that comment I I would be concerned about what this actually means. So. She says oh my best experiences were this other guy. My question would be why like was it because of some technique he used. Okay if he used a technique that's pick upable by the other guy if it's if it's because you're more attracted to him which is what it is then? Ah, now we have a problem right? It's like oh well so what's really going on here is you're not.
[38:59] Keith: Yeah, well.
[39:07] Keith: Right? right.
[39:15] Mike: Like I'm not actually a good match for you and you're going to leave me. That's what's really going to happen here.
[39:18] Keith: Yeah, maybe I mean it's definitely not great that the person she immediately brought up is her best ever was some? What did she call him an alcoholic scumbag basically right like I don't let's you say.
[39:32] Mike: Um, yeah, it's tricky I would think that.
[39:36] Keith: Immature Borderline Alcoholic Douchebag only wanted to see me when we were going to have sex So like this guy that was probably ultra Alpha you know, just invited her over with it. You know with his beck and call and.
[39:49] Mike: This strikes me as a as a problem that is uniquely applicable to women not men because I don't think that you're female I mean you could correct me on this but I don't think that your female partner's personality plays that much of a role. Or behaviors in in in how quote unquote good She is at sex for you. Would you agree with that like what? yeah what who she is as a person as people might say I don't know sure that matters that much I think I think for a guy what matters much more is like physical attractiveness and then what activities take place and how like what what's happening.
[40:19] Keith: Right.
[40:25] Keith: Um, that's I think that's right right.
[40:29] Mike: During the session of sex like so someone could be your best. It's more like it would be sort of hard to say So someone's maybe your best but it's because they're so willing to try things or do a thing that you like and so it's fairly malleable. The person could unless they're on I mean attraction is less malleable. But this thing is fairly malleable whereas for a woman.
[40:37] Keith: Um, yeah.
[40:48] Mike: Ah, unfortunately I think it's pretty tied to what they are interested in as a partner and so yeah, so basically I'm and I'm not sure that's particularly Changeable. So if if what she wanted as a partner had changed if it were changeable then I think she would conclude. Oh Well now you're my best. Because I've learned that I like guys like you and I'm really turned on by you but see she isn't she still thinks the other guy was her best which suggests to me that that is actually her Preference. So I think the guy would rightly she I mean she can lie to him or not but it doesn't really matter what's going to happen is there's going to be a problem later.
[41:24] Keith: Um, yeah, but I mean is your intuition that she would like given this man that she says was her best ever. What do you think she's looking for an apartment.
[41:33] Mike: Something something about that guy that turned her on way more I mean it could be that he it could be a physical. It could be that he's tall or something or more attractive or it could be. It's somewhat like it's very likely to be personality wise more dominant or you know.
[41:40] Keith: Um I see okay to okay.
[41:49] Keith: Um, yeah, my intuition was it was something dysfunctional like his lack of availability was very attractive to her maybe because of something with you know from her youth who knows.
[41:50] Mike: Like her dad was or something I don't know like there's some fate.
[41:57] Mike: Okay, but that's still a personality trait. Yeah, but the point is like if she's if she's learned from life experience to value that less then I would expect her to say oh well I actually am enjoying you more now because I've learned that I'm not as attracted to that. But you see she hasn't learned that now I don't know how malleable attraction is actually I don't know if a woman can kind of change internally ah from liking a guy who's not available to a guy who is available or something I'm not sure if that's possible. But if but but yeah, but it's concerning here.
[42:32] Keith: There's like an experienced self too. So like even if she had changed. It's still possible that her subjective experience of that memory back then is better than what she wants now.
[42:47] Mike: Yeah, although I would expect her to sort of do what do they call that it like it's a rtcon I would expect her to write R con that it's weird that she hasn't like there's something odd about this like I would yeah, that's what yeah I would expect her to retcon that I think that's the right thing.
[42:49] Keith: Like um, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[43:03] Mike: For a woman to do to basically decide that her current. So so it's kind of actually think it's kind of important for a woman to believe that her forever partner is her best sexual partner I think it's sort of important and if she doesn't There's something wrong I don't know what but there's something wrong.
[43:10] Keith: Right.
[43:17] Keith: Um, maybe there's a study you could do here. But yeah, you you ask like a thousand um, engaged people whether their current partner is their best ever and your intuition would be most women would say yes and less men would say yes.
[43:30] Mike: Yes, and I also would guess that the women who say no ah get divorced more and the guys the guys. So my intuition about the guys would be it be not. It would be like I bet it would be like a bell curve around.
[43:37] Keith: Um, yeah, yeah.
[43:47] Mike: Ah, yes, fifty fifty I bet it be something like that whereas the women it would be like 80% of them would say yes and it would be so actually I would actually guess it would be similar to the curve of how you know on tinder men find women. It's a bell curve of men saying women are attractive. You know like the they.
[44:06] Mike: It's It's very it's very normally distributed where the way whereas women you have to be very attractive as a man for a woman on Tinder to say that you're attractive. It'd be I think it would follow a similar distribution pattern to that. Although it's totally unrelated I think.
[44:10] Keith: Um, yeah, it's tricky with men I think men generally if you ask them who their favorite sex partner is they'd say the next one like it's like like like newness is is.
[44:25] Mike: I Don't think you well can you let's say let me ask you this of your ah of your partners. Do you think you could rank order them or do some kind I Mean do you have one that stands out interesting.
[44:28] Keith: More important than.
[44:36] Keith: Um, not really not really.
[44:41] Mike: Interesting. Ah, that's that's a little surprised you have like a group of them that stand out is there like some way in which you could you could put them into buckets. Maybe.
[44:52] Keith: Maybe I can put them into buckets. Yeah quartiles.
[44:56] Mike: Like let's say you wanted to have like 8 buckets of each each one containing I just want to fright I want to yeah I want to frighten any woman that you're date going on a date with let's get's get yeah, let's yeah at least 4 Um.
[45:02] Keith: Um, we're not doing that I mean I said court. So that applies at least for.
[45:13] Mike: Yeah I just think I I don't know I think that men would be my intuition is that something like half of men would say yes, she's the their best sexual partner and then it would I would be some kind of boring result like that I you're you're saying maybe not um, like I think what you're yourre, you may be saying him? yeah.
[45:26] Keith: Um I I don't I don't have it codified in my mind like that and I wonder if other men do.
[45:33] Mike: So men might just be like I don't know or that doesn't mean anything to me that's interesting and yeah I think it would vary I think it's it's possible that if that if a man has had say 10 partners that it's a 1 in 10 chance that his current partners is best so that wouldn't say it's fifty fifty it would be just.
[45:36] Keith: Um, right I'm not sure.
[45:51] Mike: You know you divide the denominators just how many partners you've had I could see that I could see an argument for that.
[45:57] Keith: Um, yeah to the extent that they're able to break. Yeah.
[45:58] Mike: Um, yeah, if you said if you said if you took all of your sexual encounters with women and made a list of them. Ah, and then I said what percentage of those were with your best partner I'm trying to think. Ideally, that would be kind of a high percentage for guys that might also not be very high because there's probably a lot of guys who have one encounter that's like they view as their best of course then there's going to be selective memory because they're going to remember that one better because it's more Notable. So yeah, it's It's sort of tricky but I do think that women I do think women should.
[46:19] Keith: Um, yes, that's right.
[46:27] Keith: Um, memorable. Yeah.
[46:32] Mike: Expected to recon and I do think you would get some kind of result out of an experiment like that with with women's it's a that's a pretty negative sign I think and I think the guy should rightly be concerned. Yeah, like it's and it's not because of technique or anything it's because for women, it's when men know that for women. It's very tied into how they feel about the guy.
[46:41] Keith: Um, yeah.
[46:50] Mike: And so they'd be like wait a minute like so you're settling.
[46:52] Keith: Um, yeah I mean with your take that's yet. Another reason why she should probably lie like not just because it might bruise his ego but because it might alarm him justifiably.
[47:04] Mike: I mean the counter the counter I mean that would that would raise the hackles of the guys on Tiktok talk who talk all the time about how 90% of divorces are initiated by women because they would basically say this is why because women lie this is why because women lie I don't know if that's true at all. It probably isn't.
[47:15] Keith: Um, yeah.
[47:20] Keith: Right? right.
[47:23] Mike: But it is It is true that women initiate far more divorces than men. But I always take that to just mean that women like putting women are more likely to put that final nail in the coffin because it's hard for men I think most breakups are initiated by women but it's just because men will keep the relationship around so they can have sex.
[47:41] Keith: Right.
[47:43] Mike: It's just a much much more like sort of Pedestrian explanation for that like the woman doesn't value that the guy is like look if I can keep yeah I can fuck you every month then fine anyway.
[47:49] Keith: Right? All right? Let's move on I want to talk about vulva color. This person says the guy I'm talking to is amazing but he cares about vulva color. Do you know what? the expression talking to means in Gen Z.
[48:04] Mike: Is is it mean hooking up with because I think it means talking to like like I'm talking to you.
[48:07] Keith: I mean it it could yeah it kind of means it's intentionally a bit vague but it often means the guy that I'm dating but they don't want to use the word dating so they'll say the guy I'm talking to I don't know it's It's too much. It's too much it implies too much commitment. It applies.
[48:21] Mike: Um, why? why don't they want to say dating.
[48:27] Keith: Caring too much. They'll There's this expression. It's not that serious ah like nobody wants anything to be real so they're they're just talking.
[48:36] Mike: Um, I think that's I think that's sort of normal I mean that's I mean which generation do you think is it millennials that made the most use of the term hooking up like hookup culture and so forth. Then that's sort of the same thing like I remember when hooking up just meant you had met up.
[48:43] Keith: Um, maybe yeah.
[48:50] Keith: Um, right right? like we would say yeah but we would say like oh let's hook up later but but now you can't say that because it means something else.
[48:51] Mike: And I remember being confused when people started using it to mean fuck because it's like oh we hooked up at the party and I was like oh that's nice.
[49:02] Mike: Um, well it's tricky. Yeah, um, and so that's Gen Z you're saying that. Okay, so they're talking to. So this means she's having sex with him. Okay, yeah.
[49:08] Keith: Yeah, but presumably let's let's let's read on I've been talking to this guy for about two weeks now he has great views. He has never pushed boundaries. He is sweet and wants to make sure I feel comfortable even said he wants to potentially wait until marriage to have sex because he's very serious about the person who will be with his intelligent works hard for his family works out as well. He's so good looking is a great older brother. He has friends and is very honest. He is so amazing. Let's call him a that's person a however we were having a conversation about how one of his friends was talking to a girl and apparently he asked her about the color of her vagina and. She obviously got upset and stopped and stopped talking to him I was shocked and was like wow that is really fucking weird to ask then a goes on to say not every single guy cares about color and they like and goes oh sorry a goes on to say every single guy cares about color and they like pink a little brown is okay.
[49:58] Mike: I care I care about texture. Um.
[50:06] Keith: But super brown is not acceptable and he's never met anybody who likes black asked him if that applies to him and he said am I a guy so he said every guy cares and he's a guy so it's like there's a bear shit in the woods. Yes, he does.
[50:18] Mike: Um, Sky ah lacks game go on.
[50:24] Keith: Essentially saying every single guy cares about it including him and I just went on and said that's so strange and superficial and who gives a fuck about that. Honestly, it just really disgusted me and made me think it was really surface level who cares? ah about what someone's genitals look like honestly the pleasure and the person is what matters most and it's just so weird that he said that. And for a fact that not every single guy cares about it I don't know what to do it just really gross me out I don't even it doesn't even matter what color mine is and whether or not it fits the standard. It's just the usage in the wording as well as just the idea I understand having preference for size and fitness level and everything because that has an actual difference on the sexual experience but color. Like what I'm just blown Away. What do I do I feel like this is a huge red flag. Sorry for ranting? No she no she means she means body weight and whether you're in good shape.
[51:05] Mike: Um, wait size size and fitness level of her vagina. She understands that.
[51:13] Mike: Um, okay, but I mean was she actively putting on or wearing makeup when writing this because ah I mean aren't all beauty. So okay to the extent that a beauty standard is so like facial symmetry.
[51:19] Keith: Unclear.
[51:27] Mike: There there are beauty standards that I think relate to um, ah health but most beauty standards are not that they're just arbitrary right? I mean wanting to look like Kim Kardashian or whatever the current. What what is the gen z version of that by the way. Do you know? what are they who they all try to look like.
[51:34] Keith: Um, ah, um.
[51:45] Keith: Um, ah I don't know Taylor Swift but she's sort of multi-generational. Yeah.
[51:48] Mike: I Don't think so now I haven't noticed that around college campuses I've noticed like ah what have I noticed just really really not wearing much clothing. That's what I've noticed to be the the thing. So I enjoy that right.
[52:02] Keith: Who loses.
[52:06] Mike: Um, okay, but but yeah I mean so I don't I don't really I don't really understand why a woman would be shocked at the notion that there's just another arbitrary standard of beauty that they are faced with they should they should I feel like they should understand they should have read that book.
[52:21] Keith: Um, oh I understand why she's shocked. She's shocked because she's never heard of this before and now she's panicking. She'd never considered. It's not faux. She's actually morally outraged because in her mind.
[52:25] Mike: Okay, so but but she does So so you're you're saying that there's faux moral out. It's full faux moral outrage. That's what you're saying.
[52:38] Keith: There's already so many things that she needs to worry about and now he's heaping on another one.
[52:42] Mike: Well,, but but the but the language she used in terms of moral outrage was basically to say that superficial things shouldn't Matter. It's your personality Health fitness things like that. But in fact. The other things you mentioned and the other you know the the other category of of things that she has to worry about well those are already there so shouldn't she be equally outraged about ah wearing lipstick or earrings or wearing a cute dress etc like what's the difference.
[53:11] Keith: Um, ah the difference is she didn't know about this one So it's it's new.
[53:17] Mike: That's the only difference. It's not I mean I think I mean I think it's fair to say you could say so I think you could also say something like your face is I think okay I think that people's faces evolved with the way they are because faces matter for partner selection. Meaning ah facial Beauty breast size things like this or no may not size shape like like sort of the shape of your body and stuff like that. These are things that evolved because you know in prehistoric times people did partner selection stuff like that Vulva color is not something that mattered Then. So. It's just random. So. It's not and it's going to have it's going to have excessive variation because it's irrelevant. It was irrelevant so you will have lots of variation and and it makes yeah okay.
[53:56] Keith: Um, um, okay, all right, Let's get into this. What do you think she means by vulva color.
[54:07] Mike: Um, I assume she means her out her inner labia.
[54:13] Keith: Um, okay, forgive my ignorance here. What are the ones that like are sometimes in is and outies. Okay, okay, okay so it can be more.
[54:21] Mike: Inner lady. It's the part that doesn't have hair on it. The part that does not naturally have hair on it. It's the part That's analogous, right? It's the part that's analogous to your scrotum and and and if you watch in porn. You can see that men have kind of coloring variations. Yeah.
[54:28] Keith: Right? that the so-called beef curtains.
[54:39] Mike: And that area too because and the reason why is because there's no beauty state or like doesn't make any difference. It didn't make any difference for ah reproduction.
[54:41] Keith: Um, well okay I think there are 2 different things to discuss here then there's the color of the inner labia which sometimes are more pink-ish than others and then there's the sort of like area.
[54:52] Mike: Are you.
[55:00] Keith: Around which I guess you're calling the outer lavia but also around that which sometimes can have some sort of dark. It's going to use the word discoloration. But maybe I should just say coloration.
[55:08] Mike: Yeah, of course naturally I mean in a state of nature that would be definitely covered with hair but sure I mean by the way your scalp can have disc discolorations on it If you're bald I mean like a lot of times when guys shave their heads. They're sort of surprised because it's like some people have like birthmarks on their scalp some people. Yeah, it's but it's definitely not.
[55:13] Keith: Um, yes.
[55:20] Keith: Um.
[55:23] Keith: Um, yeah, not something you and I have had to Confront yet.
[55:28] Mike: It's clear that like there was it's It's just clear. There was no evolutionary. There was no evolutionary pressure for your scalp to look a certain way whereas there there. Yeah to look healthy and to reproduce particularly for a man but of course men and women are very. It takes a man and a woman So like these genetic choices wind up evolve. Um.
[55:45] Keith: Um, nevertheless if you have a scalp like Mikhail Gorbachev I think that's less attractive than ah Michael Jordan's
[55:46] Mike: But propagating.
[55:49] Mike: not when he had hair. Oh not when he had hair oh okay fine but it's but but the point is that during reproductive age which prehistorically would have been teens 20 s um, you would have hair covering it it so would matter might my point being that like I think it's. Pretty obvious that like the exact way your vulval looks is not something that was selected for in the same way that ah fine fine features fine facial features is something that females have selected for that's why women's faces look more delicate than men's like it it mattered first mate selection and the like you know.
[56:21] Keith: Um, are you making an argument that nothing about the physical appearance appearance of the vagina there would there would be no trends if you showed men a thousand different vaginas and had them rate them on appearance. You would you would notice. No.
[56:39] Mike: No I'm arguing that that ah and on along an evolutionary timescale say ten thousand plus years that that appearance of vulva would make no difference to which women were impregnated by whom.
[56:52] Keith: Um, okay.
[56:54] Mike: It just doesn't it wouldn't have matter and that and that's what matters for evolving evolving a trade right? whereas a woman with real really rough facial features that might actually matter guys wouldn't necessarily she would she would get impregnated by a lower status guy or kids wouldn't get cared for as well etc because she's less. She's less quote unquote attractive. Um.
[57:11] Keith: Um, yeah, but that doesn't change whether or not men have preferences in general.
[57:13] Mike: And yeah.
[57:18] Mike: It doesn't it doesn't but it's but like but what I'm doing doing is I'm trying to bolster why she could have like a moral outrage here like so I'm I was sort of mocking her for having moral outrage about vulva 2 things that are both superficial. But I think that if she was a little more careful with their language. She could do it well because she could say look I don't mind the men rate women's attractiveness on body shape facial structure These things that like kind of do Matter. Um, but it's kind of crappy to do it for something that will do matter that even that's a strong thing to say but do things that. Historically are there. There is some kind of Beauty Standard. It's kind of crappy to do it based on something that where there's absolutely no beauty standard and so it's it's just it's just random that being said, it's not a strong.. It's yeah I hear you it's not a strong moral Eyeground. It's it's It's a very low Plateau She's standing on.
[58:03] Keith: Um, I mean women shave their legs.
[58:11] Keith: Um, well and they do other things too like they they shave their assholes. They wax their assholes they bleach their assholes. So no, they didn't It didn't matter. You're right like having darkened skin around your asshole wouldn't have mattered.
[58:11] Mike: Because it it is pretty arbitrary. Sure sure but they didn't they didn't ten thousand years ago probably but but ten thousand years ago women did do stuff like ah. Well I'm not sure about 10000 but it's almost certain that they put on makeup and did various things to look more attractive and young and so these are things women did they did their hair certainly during ah the roman empire there were ah there were women's hair. There were women's hairstyles and they've they changed.
[58:40] Keith: Um, yeah.
[58:42] Mike: Ah, they weren't always the same and this is yeah so there's there's been beauty around the facial area for a long long long time. Ah you know finding women's breasts beautiful. Obviously it's been but but Vulva area. No like that's it was just not. There was no beauty standard for that and but in particular I mean if you're in a society.
[58:57] Keith: Um, ah okay I think this point is not important and I don't understand why this is.
[59:02] Mike: Hang on I want to I know I just want to say 1 more thing for fun ah in a society where women are on average having like 11 children each that area is not going to be the best. It's good. You know what? I mean like after your 11 after your eleventh kid. There will be some like damage and in this is without modern medicine. So there we've been tearing and.
[59:09] Keith: Um, ah you know, probably not.
[59:18] Keith: Right.
[59:20] Mike: So I mean like it's just not an area. Yeah, it's it's an area that probably people would it's it was a utilitarian area and still is on you know anyway, go on.
[59:26] Keith: Um, yeah, generally if you are to the point where a woman's panties are coming off like there aren't many things that are going to make a man no doubt. Okay, there are some things right? like a a fucking herpee. Um, some sort of weird pus.
[59:40] Mike: Yes I think that a single us I think a single pustule would be properly called a herp as a herp but go on. Yeah, not a herpee.
[59:45] Keith: Ah, maybe an awful smell.
[59:51] Keith: Um, sorry we we've actually discussed this before and someday I'll learn I'm too busy thinking about the Roman Empire ah
[59:59] Mike: There's no word by the way because it's not herpes is a disease. It's not the name of the individual thing we go on. No no ah Herpes is the disease. You don't I have herpes means I have the disease herpes. It doesn't mean I have pustules. It's not the plural of something. It's just it's like measles.
[01:00:05] Keith: Um, it's it's it's a sore.
[01:00:17] Mike: You don't say I have a measle right I have measles the disease. It's just a disease name that ends in an s so it's all confusing.
[01:00:19] Keith: Ah, don't you do I say I have a pox the chicken pox. No I say I have a okay.
[01:00:26] Mike: Well apox is a different thing I mean the the word chicken box comes from because the real world word for chicken Pox is like um, not verael, but it's yeah you know there's ah, there's a scientific name for it. Chicken poxes comes from like the fact that a pox was like ah a spell cast on you right? So that's a little different but anyway.
[01:00:40] Keith: Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, all right.
[01:00:45] Mike: I Like calling it a herp that's fine I hear your point like so a guy's not going to nope out but you a guy could still have an opinion and we've discussed this before like beauty wise men are going to find a shaved a shaved vvem more beautiful or waxed or whatever more beautiful for sure right.
[01:00:52] Keith: Um, ah yes I right? That's where I was going correct. They'll still fuck one. That's not shaved. But yeah, that doesn't mean that they don't that some men don't prefer it was.
[01:01:04] Mike: Yeah, it's it's sort of complicated. It's an area where a woman I'm not sure what she should do having moral outrage about it about it's probably not helpful. Um, she should just try to not care because it's not because you're right that by the time the guy gets there. He it's not it doesn't make any difference.
[01:01:21] Keith: Right? Yeah, we've talked about this with respect to labia before too right? like the the bigger the beef curtains probably the the less you know, perfectly desirable they are but most men are not going to.
[01:01:23] Mike: Not going. He's not going to break up with her because of that there's no chance I mean there's very little chance of that.
[01:01:40] Keith: Actually be like oh you know what? I'm seeing four millimeters here I'm out.
[01:01:42] Mike: I Think it's like the I think it's the vast majority of men are going to sort of go out. Okay, so it's it's not but that I mean so yeah, so they could probably have an interesting conversation that would end with that. It's like yes I have a it's the conversation you and I have had I have a preference I think this is more beautiful and she probably does too actually because it's just.
[01:01:59] Keith: Are.
[01:02:01] Mike: Now you're just talking about like what's beautiful like things that are you know a flower that looks a certain way more beautiful and maybe people can have conversations about that but it doesn't actually affect attraction. Um, although I but I do think generally this thing of like women being judged by.
[01:02:09] Keith: Um, yeah.
[01:02:19] Mike: Physical traits. They don't control yeah difficults to I'm sure it's a very. It's a difficult part of being female and she's in some ways wrestling with that or reckoning with it.
[01:02:30] Keith: Um, I mean I don't control how handsome I am.
[01:02:31] Mike: It matters a lot less for guys. That's but I mean yeah, you know we've as discussed ad nauseum for guys like if you're at the very top end of attractiveness it matters a lot. But for everybody else, It's kind of irrelevant. So it's it's in then it. Yeah so but for women for women. It almost completely is just attractiveness.
[01:02:42] Keith: Yeah, yeah, are a agree and we're out of time right? All right? Thank you for listening to this episode of your mileage may vary. We like feedback you can provide us feedback at YMM the pod.
[01:02:51] Mike: Okay.
[01:03:02] Keith: At Gmail.com if you send us feedback we will give you $10 so just ah and at the end of the feedback give us your cash up or Paypal or venmo or whatever your preferred method of money delivery of choices. Ah, you can also ask us questions there which. We enjoy getting if you'd like to keep we'll respond we respond to basically everything we get unless it's a dick pic. We've sort of stopped responding to those. Ah, but if yeah if you have a question about anything you can you can send it to us if you want us to keep it private. Let us know so we don't use it on the show. Again, that's ymmvpodat gml.com. Thanks for listening and we will catch you next week on your mileage may vary.

YMMVYour Mileage May Vary

Episode 136: Small Sex Dolls, Vulva Color, Resensitization, Best Sex Partner Ever

Episode Transcript