Your Mileage May Vary: Soul Mate Seeking, Pegging Agreements, Small Packages, Female Self-Pleasuring During The Act

Episode Transcript

Transcript automatically generated by a robot. Apologies for any inaccuracies.

[00:00] Keith: Hello and welcome to your mileage may vary. We talk about sex and relationships with frankness that is often controversial but mostly in good faith on today's show we are going to talk about a deal to try pegging in exchange for anal whether to tolerate awful sex women taking agency in their own pleasure and more. I Keith my co-host is Mike longtime. No talk mike that's true. Yeah I have I have covered and now it is.
[00:21] Mike: Well not for our listeners. But yeah, we recorded a couple episodes and then do you want to tell why our listeners why your voice is so kind of soft and lilting today. Oh it's not because you got pegged for the first time and it sort of changed your personality. Yeah.
[00:38] Keith: Is not an autobiographical story. We're going to get into later.
[00:42] Mike: Um, so Covid has put a crimp in your how long have you had covid.
[00:47] Keith: Um, like more than two weeks I had it and then it it was testing negative for a while and I'm testing positive again.
[00:54] Mike: Well, but you're you're pretty clearly on the tail and you showed me your most recent test and it was very faint if that means anything yeah and you have been excluded have have you done any dating while covered positive.
[00:59] Keith: Yes, yes, the faintest of lines. Yeah.
[01:11] Keith: No I have not if I had I I wouldn't say so because they would be deplorable but I actually have not.
[01:13] Mike: How does it fair fair. How does it go when you tell a young lady that you need to beg off of a date because of Covid like does it are they welcoming to that or do they sort of does it not work.
[01:26] Keith: Um, it's interesting So I had 2 dates lined up with with 2 different ladies and I canceled both of them and I told both of them hey I'm really sorry about this I'd I'd like to reschedule but I don't even know. I'm going to be better I don't know what like the right number of days after I start testing positive start testing negative until I could actually see anyone anyway and they were both like oh thanks for letting me know that's too bad. You know hope you're feeling better. Um, but.
[01:48] Mike: Um, sure.
[02:01] Mike: Um, was that did they ghost you then.
[02:03] Keith: Well well I mean what are they supposed to do check in on me, we've never even met I mean they could offer to bring me soup I've had friends do that you you didn't do that. But I've had other friends do that.
[02:07] Mike: Yeah, yeah, I'm not sure.
[02:16] Mike: Yeah I think I'm not sure what I what if anything I did. It's a fair point.
[02:20] Keith: I Mean what he supposed to do I would I I would decline any at all soup offers.
[02:30] Mike: The Ah so but okay, but but it did it did did it derail the dating procedure completely. Okay, okay, and no woman asked to sort of you know care for you.
[02:37] Keith: Ah I suspect it will yeah it will have yeah.
[02:48] Mike: Kind of like I'll help you get through this I'll nurse you nobody wanted to nurse you I don't mean nurse in the lactation way. That's interesting right.
[02:52] Keith: I've had I've had friends but none of these would be people. There was somebody that I was that I'd been on a ah few dates with who I actually think maybe the person who got me sick.
[03:05] Mike: Oh good.
[03:08] Keith: Ah, she offered I Actually I think she might have made me soup and then offered to bring it to me I I went back and and read our text messages and I thought she was like offering to bring me soup but I went back and reread and it actually reads like she made me soup and then I declined it. Ah.
[03:22] Mike: Oh interesting, she'd made you something I thought that you're going to say that she's but she wanted to sell it to you. Her offer.
[03:27] Keith: So.
[03:31] Keith: no no I mean you know I've had the covid excuse used on me at least a half dozen times it it feels like it doesn't but it's probably more like a half dozen and so when I was using it.
[03:44] Mike: Um, okay.
[03:47] Keith: Ah, because I actually had covered it occurred to me that it's not the most believable thing so I tried to compensate for that by saying like oh I'd really like to reschedule how many days should I test me but you know I was trying to get some feedback back? um.
[04:01] Mike: Sure We we might as well. I mean since this is not a topic that's brought up in the media or has been around this pandemic. It. It obviously killed a lot of people and so on and so Forth. Um, but we don't know whether it killed people's interest in masturbating. So Would you say that Covid has any delta versus say a cold or a flu on that.
[04:16] Keith: Um I have so did you read my notes for today's show okay I have been masturbating like an insane amount and.
[04:22] Mike: No I didn't but it just I just thought of it.
[04:30] Mike: Um, interesting.
[04:31] Keith: You know part of it is I've been locked in my house for going out three weeks now and so I'm pretty bored but ah I mean but I mean today I've already masturbated 3 times and I've masturbated.
[04:45] Mike: It's ah four p M our our time. So so you three what time did you wake up.
[04:50] Keith: Ah, probably 7 7 a m.
[04:53] Mike: Okay, so on average, you've masturbated every ah every 3 hours or two and a half hours 2 hours 40 minutes so far to day. Okay, and that's just you think a function of but it like it didn't that.
[04:57] Keith: Yes I Guess yeah yeah, that's assuming I masturbated as soon as I woke up which actually is not quite the case.
[05:10] Mike: True. Ah so it but it doesn't it doesn't ah lower your sex drive in other words like I think that it's fair to say a cold and ah or a flu kind of does make it less something you want to be doing.
[05:20] Keith: Yeah I agree I don't remember for sure I wish I wish I was more careful about tracking my orgasms but I'm not so I'm just relying on my my memory here but my recollection is yeah when you have a colder flu and you're really congested I think.
[05:32] Mike: Um.
[05:37] Mike: Yeah.
[05:40] Keith: It's it's hard to do anything. That's even a little bit physical. It just feels like a lot of work but I don't really have body aches or body soreness and so I've been able to capably masturdate.
[05:43] Mike: Sure.
[05:52] Mike: Um, is so it is the thing keeping you in is the thing cooping up you in your apartment just sort of like a social ah a willingness to kind of quarantine yourself to protect others I mean that's pretty laudable if so.
[06:03] Keith: Yeah I Well I mean my my main social outlet is my run club and I haven't been doing that because I can't run and also I think showing up to ah to a ride with Covid would be considered poor form.
[06:08] Mike: So okay.
[06:16] Mike: And the runs you guys do are often long enough that you might have to stop to masturbate it sounds like.
[06:24] Keith: Yeah I mean if this is my new my new normal. Ah you know? yeah I'm gonna have to to try to work it into my to my long runs.
[06:29] Mike: Um, right hard to like do a good marathon time if you can't go very long without beating off. Okay, so so you found throughout the entire There wasn't even one day when you're in the depths the Throes of this.
[06:37] Keith: Um, yeah.
[06:44] Mike: You kind of took a day off or a week off or something. Okay I was also thinking that if you lost your did you lose your sense of taste and or smell okay because then you could have.
[06:45] Keith: There must have been but again I don't have a spreadsheet I have spreadsheets for a lot of things but not for that. No I my a little bit a little bit I was there were a few days when I was a little bit congested and I got a little panicked about the loss of lack of taste. But no, that was it was just because I couldn't breathe through my nose not because I covered.
[07:04] Mike: Um, okay, okay, so there was no way to use this to like ah get over your fear of semen either.
[07:14] Keith: No yeah would have been a good time to try c in for the first time.
[07:17] Mike: Well I mean you wouldn't really get the full experience. Try Semen Oh man, that's that doesn't sound good when you say it that way.
[07:25] Keith: Have you seen those ads on Pornhub for s semen semen ax I think it's called Semen Max baby
[07:34] Mike: These are the ones where it looks like ah a person's penis is basically turned into like a ah a glue dispenser or something the the amount of semen that comes out.
[07:43] Keith: Ah, the ad I've been seeing I've been using fort hub a lot and I guess my ad blocker doesn't get the Pornhub ads this week you know it's sort of like a battle between the ah steroid takers and the steroid testers. There's.
[07:54] Mike: Sure.
[07:56] Keith: Is brief windows where the ad blockers don't catch the newest ad technology. But anyway the ad is you know in an s to be 5 seconds because after 5 seconds you could skip it so they you know they really want to deliver the the the nut before before they were at a time. Yeah, so there's 2 shot gala.
[08:04] Mike: Right? Yeah, the punchline has to come really quick right.
[08:13] Keith: 2 shot glasses and on the left it says but before semen accident on the right, you know after semen max and ah they they're pouring some fluid it it looks like semen.
[08:21] Mike: Um I don't understand who the target so I have seen that at and is I don't understand who the Target Market Market is for it because like.
[08:28] Keith: I think teenagers and like people in their twenty s who think that like semen volume is really important and and I believe that there is something you could do to meaningfully change your seaman volume.
[08:36] Mike: Um, sure. But.
[08:40] Mike: Um, that makes sense to me but the thing I don't understand is showing a shot glass full of semen and as a way to market the product right? it would it would be like this. It would be like if you ah if you were let's say you were a a marketer at.
[08:46] Keith: Yeah, it's not my favorite ad.
[08:56] Mike: Ah, is it Procter and gamble that makes meimusal I'm not sure but say ah makers of Metamusil Makers of like some other sort of bowel regularity product and your suggestion was to show a toilet just getting full of like shit as the ad it's like that's not like like people want you to be a little bit kind of oblique in the way you yeah.
[09:07] Keith: Ah, right right? little toy.
[09:15] Mike: And I mean I like yeah I can see people buying such a product because of the things you said, but but yeah I mean you'd want to I don't know use like have like a super soaker that like shoots a lot of water but don't make them because yeah, it's it's and you're in the middle of beating off when you see it and it's really disgusting. It's like what.
[09:26] Keith: yeah yeah I I wish I'm looking forward to next week when it's a new ad and that these had it always seems to be 1 to 3 ads but in the in the constant rotation.
[09:39] Mike: My favorite ads on there. So I Only ever see them if I'm on a phone instead of a computer I'm not sure why my computer ad Blocker seems to work well for for Net fourub. But my favorite ad it's not my favorite but the one that's most notable that I get on the phone is this woman who just says tired of beating off alone. She says it really loudly and like ah with a like they put a lot of compression on her voice. So The problem is if you have the sound up at all on your phone like it's much louder than the sound of the porns and so it's It's basically designed to embarrass you so somebody walking by wherever you are Here's just that you know.
[09:58] Keith: Yeah. Yes.
[10:13] Keith: Right? Yeah I'm trying to think what the other ads are there's one for yeah well yeah, that's right? So I think that's for a site called Bait Mate and.
[10:17] Mike: Yeah, and who's who's tired of beating off alone I mean like that's the Point. No. Okay.
[10:31] Keith: I haven't clicked the ad but presumably. It's so that you can masturbate online with somebody but I would hope so.
[10:37] Mike: I assume it's a woman who's supposed to what? Well first of all, it's a I have to give them bravo that you remember the name like obviously their ads working on someone I did not know the name of the product or service. We should ah reach out to them for a sponsorship just kidding. We don't we don't do sponsorships but ah the ah.
[10:43] Keith: Yeah, yeah.
[10:54] Mike: The yeah I mean that's I'm not sure what the idea is there I could go to baitmate.com and see but I'm a little scared. Okay, maybe you invented that name.
[11:02] Keith: There's no sight I was just checking myself. So maybe it's not a a yeah but but the idea I mean it's something like that I think how I'll commit to click through I mean Mike, what's going on here is I think most people. Don't masturbate 3 times a day and so you know they have their normal sort of ad replacement cadence and for me, it's it's not often enough because I'm I'm getting oversaturated in ah and content here.
[11:30] Mike: Right? I don't I mean like I guess I would like company while beating off, but it would I'd need something like a holodeck from Star Trek It would have to be something at that level like just just some woman on the screen who's going to I guess compliment my dick is not going to get there.
[11:40] Keith: Oh yeah.
[11:46] Keith: Yeah, how would you position yourself so that your webcam I guess it doesn't have to you could just put it on your cocks. They they don't need to see your face.
[11:54] Mike: There are definitely guys on Chatterbait who will in the comments try to get people to click on their profile and I've clicked on it before and they do just have their camera aimed at their crotch and you just see their dick and so that there's some allure appeal to that they've weaponized it basically.
[12:03] Keith: Okay, yeah.
[12:12] Keith: Um, yeah, right.
[12:14] Mike: Although I assume it's erotic for them. They're not just doing it to like because they know it bums me out. But maybe ah you yeah and they have some hope that the cam girl will click and look at it as well. Probably.
[12:23] Keith: Right? Yeah, okay, that'll make sense but I just I would think most men would feel a little bit uncomfortable with the concept of going on camera and masturbating with someone even if they. In concept would like to have the company of a beautiful woman watching them. There's a.
[12:46] Mike: What if she was hang on it if if there was a beautiful woman masturbating and and it was believable at the same time you wouldn't that wouldn't amp it up a little for you. That's true.
[12:56] Keith: Okay, first of all, let's just acknowledge. That's not whatever that site is it's not that. Ah, but yeah in concept if there was a beautiful woman who was super into be and she wanted to watch me masturbate that might amp things up a little bit.
[13:08] Mike: Yeah I mean if a person and by the way if a person wants to understand what camgirls actually think I do recommend even though I was it's one of the subredds have been banned from is the cam Girlss Camirl problems subreddit really gives you like an insight into what they think and it's not good. In fact.
[13:18] Keith: Yeah. Yeah, it's just so ordinary.
[13:27] Mike: Oh no, it's It's I mean well Okay, yeah, there's a lot of ordinary but but there's to the extent that they have sort of strong feelings or strong thoughts about stuff. It's really negative about the men. It's really pejorative toward them and it's kind of it's kind of amazing that they're able to carry on with that kind of work. Given how badly how Ill they think of the of the men and how they're how it's all just like how many tokens can I get out of these guys.
[13:46] Keith: Yeah I mean the kind of man who frequents that kind of sight really is sort of pathetic and degenerate. So.
[13:57] Mike: Um, why? yeah do you think I'm pathetic and degenerate Keith.
[14:00] Keith: Ah, ah I don't think you're the standard ah Chatterbait user. You think most people there are they're just anthropologically.
[14:04] Mike: I think I am I think I think it's that the key difference is that no no I enjoy it sometimes I mean like they have some you know there's stuff on there. That's good like it's good.
[14:15] Keith: What percentage of your masturbation sessions. Do you use chatterate for okay and what percentage of your visits to chatterbate are to masturbate versus anthropologically it kicked off.
[14:20] Mike: Under 5
[14:29] Mike: I'll look at it sometimes just to sort of like have some arousing content like sometimes if you just go like the the thing about it is that I don't care like I don't participate in the little games they play on there where they're trying to get you to give them tokens to like.
[14:40] Keith: Yeah.
[14:42] Mike: Get them to do the next thing on their menu I don't really care like from my perspective. It's like looking at a Playboy magazine. It's like oh look here's some attractive people. It's just that.
[14:46] Keith: Right? Yeah, they try to gamify it right? They're like oh if if I get a hundred tokens from my audience I'll show you my asshole or something right? okay.
[14:54] Mike: Right? There was one I saw recently her whole shtick was that she was brand new. It was actually a clever shtick and so she said she'd never shown her. Yeah, she'd never shown her naked body on Cam and also that she was really shy.
[15:02] Keith: Right? Just just like all the virgin porn.
[15:12] Mike: So what she would do is she would demand like tons and tons of tokens. She would get them from ah like they would sum up the tokens given by a bunch of people I mean of course remember that like the total she was getting was like thirty bucks but ok and then she would show something and then she would run out of the room.
[15:20] Keith: I know I know yeah.
[15:29] Mike: Which was obviously just an affected thing she was doing ah act shy. Yes, like oh I can't believe I just did that but it's just some emotional content and people fall for it. So I mean there are people. There are a lot of people with just no access to women I guess which is unsurprising when you. Ah.
[15:29] Keith: Oh she's trying to Ape being a shy person. Okay, yeah.
[15:43] Keith: Yeah I mean.
[15:48] Mike: Consider the incel commentary. So.
[15:50] Keith: I can imagine you know what? it's like it's a little bit like gambling like I can imagine. But when you go to Vegas You see all the lights and all the different games have slightly different strategies for getting their hooks into you and I can see it and I can imagine.
[16:04] Mike: Yeah, yeah.
[16:10] Keith: Falling for that. But for me I don't really and so it's sort of the same with with chatter beed like I can imagine being in a room with a girl and even though I don't completely believe her feeling like I have some agency and the next thing she's going to do could be sort of titillating.
[16:13] Mike: Um, yeah.
[16:26] Mike: Um, right? Yeah I could imagine being titillating to I think that the bad feeling I would get from having to pay for that agency. But if somebody gave here's the thing somebody gave me like you know 10000 chatterbait tokens I would probably spend them.
[16:28] Keith: It's not for me but I can I can imagine.
[16:34] Keith: Yeah.
[16:39] Keith: Yeah, you would try to do something or but yeah, you would try to do something preposterous. You would try to do deliver experiments I Kind of want to give you did as good. Do kids to see what you can come up with.
[16:42] Mike: You know I would probably spend them and it be kind of fun but I would probably do kind of silly things. That's right, yeah like I I see you have a banana on your counter over there? Yeah yeah, go into your garage and get a screwdriver.
[17:00] Keith: Yeah, that's that's the first 20 tokens. Yeah I could imagine I wonder if there are any people on are there any viewers on Chatterbait that are like sort of famous because they're they're interesting.
[17:17] Mike: I Don't know the answer then there certainly are heavy like ah what would you call like I was going to say heavy hitters but people who spend a lot like kind of repeat customers who are on there a lot. Um, well I mean I guess they're they're just people that the women will talk about because they.
[17:26] Keith: So there's infamous users but maybe not.
[17:34] Mike: Soak them for a lot of money and they're proud of it. You know they're good customers. Oh yeah, yeah, there's definitely like an 8020 or ninety ten rule with the users on chatterbate like most people give you almost nothing and then there's a set of whales and I don't really know what motivates those people.
[17:35] Keith: I see well and they probably get excited when they come in the room right? because? yeah.
[17:47] Keith: Right? I think twitch is the same way.
[17:53] Mike: And I really don't know where the money comes for for twitch because I always assume that like the the modal person on there is like a 13 year old boy.
[18:02] Keith: Ah, yeah, I'm not sure I'm sure that it's very few of the producers make anything even worth discussing. But those few do make a ton and so um.
[18:10] Mike: Right? And notably on Twitch the dynamic as I understand it is there. The people that are really good at the video game and then there is the attractive women who are okay at the video game or whatever it is that they're doing right.
[18:26] Keith: Yeah.
[18:29] Mike: I guess there are going to be some attractive women that are also really good. But I think that's a very very small Venn diagram there.
[18:34] Keith: There's the game that I play the most is heroes of the storm and I watch ah some people play it on ah Twitch and their skill at the game is not a requirement for it to be compelling to watch. It's it's more important if the person is compelling to watch like they say interesting things or like there's this one guy that gets tilted all the time and he's sort of fun to watch because he's just so miserable as a person and for so reason that I find that inter dating. But.
[18:55] Mike: Donka.
[19:04] Mike: Does he like throw the computer across the room and stuff like that.
[19:08] Keith: It's He's just constantly complaining about his teammates and nothing is ever his fault and he's so certain of his superiority. It's you know that's the human condition I that reminds me have you noticed.
[19:14] Mike: It's kind of funny. Now.
[19:25] Keith: Dated a few women who have tiktoks and you know occasionally I'll get served at Tiktok or a real and I'll click through to see how many views and like what their other um videos have have gotten first of all is there a way to sort on Tiktok.
[19:39] Mike: Sure.
[19:44] Keith: By number of views. You can't right. There isn't okay, but yeah, they must be doing that on purpose probably because you would get a ah sort of Manifest destiny anything.
[19:45] Mike: No I mean there might be on the web interface but on the mobile interface. There definitely is not okay, then no, there isn't.
[19:59] Keith: The the top things would always be at the top so they'll stay at the top or something. Yeah, okay, all right? Whatever I'm I'm surprised that people create tiktoks.
[20:00] Mike: Well, and also there's an element of a timeline. So like there often. They'll be multi-part things or things that are responses to things so they're encouraging you to kind of follow follow the yeah.
[20:16] Keith: And Instagram content and social media content generally when they have modest followings like are they imagining that they're going to like get big someday like that's their hope surely. That's why they're making these things.
[20:29] Mike: You mean people that aren't just sharing like everyday things people that are making kind of produced content that seems like it took a while to make.
[20:33] Keith: Yeah, oftentimes poorly produced but it took more than it's more than them just walking down the street and saying something extemporaneously.
[20:43] Mike: Yeah I mean yes I think that in general they're hoping that they'll be the one that gets lucky.
[20:48] Keith: And you know they'll have they'll have dozens or a hundred of these videos and ah, you know, maybe you know one of them will have gotten like 10000 views once but you know most of them are in the hundreds or the low thousands and it's just such a modest.
[21:06] Keith: Amount of interest and it's I don't know it feels a little pathetic.
[21:08] Mike: Yeah, yeah, yeah, well I mean but that's that's probably what how people the people to get ah known start out right.
[21:18] Keith: Of course yeah, there's a chicken chicken and egg thing there I Guess yeah, all right? Okay, all right? Ah, let's get into some of these topics I teased in the intro so we have the the normal.
[21:24] Mike: Um, yeah.
[21:35] Keith: Ah, you know if you let me peg you then you can do anal with me situation here but I wanted to I have an interesting take on this all right? So this person says girlfriend said I could do anal if she could peg me I oblige she's backing out of her end of the deal. So I have a big anal fetish and of course I've been with my girlfriend for 3 years and I've asked her to do anal.
[21:44] Mike: Um, okay.
[21:54] Keith: First time 2 times she said no and that was in the beginning the relationship but I just recently asked again and she made the deal that if she could peg me first with the dildo the size of my penis that I could do anal on her I agreed because it was a fair proposition to see the pain she would have to go through so I could be more gentle with her when it was my time to. Sorry this guy's grammar when it was my turn time goes on and we clone my penis and she pegs me with it. So okay I'm putting some words in his mouth here. But I think he got you know there's those services where you can get a wax mold of your penis and they'll make a dildo of your penis. So.
[22:27] Mike: Yeah, yeah, you can do it mail order. You can just make ah a mold and then I don't know if it's wax I'm not sure what exactly it is. But yeah, they'll well I mean I think it's something that hardens around your penis and then like it's in like into like a shell 2 parts. So then you can.
[22:33] Keith: How does it work. Yeah.
[22:44] Keith: And do they send you packaging so that it doesn't get damaged in transit.
[22:44] Mike: Mail it to them and they make I think so yeah, there's some some way that works I know I've seen a porn or some video of a woman doing this procedure of her labia to make into it. Kind of a flashlight like toy.
[23:03] Keith: Um, couldn't you make your own like whatever makes this mold couldn't you just use the mold and use your own wax then to make your own like why do you have to send to back? Yeah, but would wax work.
[23:09] Mike: Your own Dildo I mean know a dildo's not made of wax. It's made of something else right? I mean it would be pretty unforgiving and Rigid and also might break and splinter and so forth. Yeah, yeah.
[23:22] Keith: Okay, all right, all right? All ah, this guy goes on I didn't hate it. But I didn't enjoy it either to me. It was me now that my end of the deal has been sealed. She's but she's backing up and saying I don't want to go through it. This cityie ward profusely keeps apologizing to me to me I feel kind of used because if she never promised to do anal. Would have never let her pick me in the first place as of now I've taken time to myself just to collect my thoughts and we'll talk to her in the morning I don't I don't I don't know man this guy's english is not just first language. Ah, and then he says edit Lefter. Thank you all not responding to comments now.
[23:44] Mike: I would have never let her pick me meaning you wouldn't have dated her. Okay.
[23:59] Keith: You know, a lot of people but some people say the obvious thing you may you you made you both made a stupid decision to make your sex transactional which is unhealthy and unsustainable. She's also then broken that trust because she thought she could pluff you out of something. She's uncomfortable About. Of course she did this because you are clearly interested in. She wants to make you happy? Ok and this guy points Out. You've asked 3 times after being told no here's the thing that I think is sort of of I don't maybe this isn't that interesting. Ok he didn't like it. He didn't like receiving the anal. But then he still wants to do it to her is there anything else like this in sex where it's like there's something I really want to do to you that I know is physically uncomfortable for you I Know it's physically uncomfortable because you did it to me first like I've I've experienced that displeasure. But I'm putting my own pleasure.
[24:33] Mike: Are.
[24:51] Keith: Such ah such a position that I I want to make you feel badly. Is there anything else in sex. That's like that.
[24:55] Mike: Well, you're not I mean are you going to reject? you're probably going to reject it if I argue that like just the physical act of penetration is like that I want to penetrate you I don't want to be penetrated because you could look. You could be pegged by something. Yeah.
[25:09] Keith: Ah, well they have a they have an orifice I don't have and my maybe it's naive. Ah assumption is that the feeling of being penetrated in the hole. They're ah biologically meant to be penetrated in is.
[25:24] Mike: Here.
[25:27] Keith: Less of in a position. Maybe not even at all in a position and with me of course not in a position because I'm I'm so great at sex. Um, yeah I would expect that that that's different than than anal. Yeah.
[25:30] Mike: Okay.
[25:35] Mike: Okay, okay, that's fair. So so because I mean you could be pegged by a sufficiently thin or something dildo. So it wouldn't I'm sure it would basically not be painful like something the size of a finger would be. You know.
[25:46] Keith: Yeah.
[25:54] Mike: I'm not sure. Um, okay, but we yeah we can set that aside so like just just the act of penetration. So the question is so I mean yeah, there are other things here but is there something that some other thing where or is it is there a normal or commonly done thing where it's like I I want to do this to you but I don't want you to do it to me.
[25:56] Keith: Yes.
[26:12] Keith: Yeah, ah sure like ah I'm trying to think of an analogy here like what this guy is doing is actually kind of Shitty is like oh I tried it myself I discovered it sucks? Yeah, but I still want to do it I Still want to do it to you.
[26:12] Mike: Because it would be painful.
[26:28] Mike: Um, it's hard because there aren't perfect analogies for this stuff between men and women so I could say like swallow semen but then it's like well. But but but men don't you know that but that's like adirectal thing right.
[26:31] Keith: Um, yeah, yeah.
[26:39] Keith: Heterosexual Men don't want to do that in heterosexual men presumably or at least whatever we don't have to get into this right now but presumably they do want to do it.
[26:48] Mike: Um, I think that okay I mean I think that it's somewhat common for a man to want to put a finger up The woman's butt and not want to finger up his butt I mean that's like a fairly common one.
[26:57] Keith: Yeah, but is a man does the man want to do that because he thinks she's getting pleasure from it or does he want to do it because it's dirty or naughty. Maybe he wants to do it because he thinks she's not getting pleasure from it like what's going on there. Yes, they do.
[27:10] Mike: Some women claim to get pleasure from that. So it's not impossible that he wants. Yeah, it's not impossible. He wants to do it that ask for a finger up their butt.
[27:17] Keith: I've I've been with multiple women that like prefer it ask for it. Request it? yeah.
[27:23] Mike: And my recollection about this is the way that they ask for it is they just wiggle their butt or something They don't actually say it and so then you you don't actually know they were asking for that like you you did it you oblige and then they smiled or something they moaned.
[27:27] Keith: Yeah, that's right.
[27:37] Keith: Ah I I'm thinking here I mean I've definitely ah, post act had conversations about it I'm trying to.
[27:43] Mike: Approvingly.
[27:53] Keith: Think about before I know so it's like a but let's say it's a new partner and you know I'm I'm cupping their their their buttock and I can feel them sort of shimmy in such a way that's insinuating my finger toward their asshole. Ah.
[27:57] Mike: Um, yeah.
[28:06] Mike: Um, how do you differentiate between their them shimmying your finger toward their asshole or their vagina.
[28:13] Keith: Yeah, it's it's just a. It's just a feeling Mike I don't I don't know how to describe the exact. The exact thing here. But I mean importantly, you can tell when people are not insinuating toward their asshole. You know they kind of like.
[28:17] Mike: Okay, okay.
[28:27] Mike: How does that work.
[28:30] Keith: Turn away a little bit or you know clenched like you can tell when people don't want any attention there.
[28:34] Mike: Okay, okay, but I mean but okay so why would ah I mean I think that but my answer of why a guy would want to do that is It's just more dominant right? It's like I'm penetrating you more I'm penetrating you harder.
[28:47] Keith: Yeah.
[28:49] Mike: Which makes sense to me that that like kind of turns the guy on um and why would a woman want to do that to a guy I don't know because she's like it gives her some measure of control. She might fetishize it there when I can see reasons both directions I yeah.
[29:02] Keith: We've had people on the show claim that you know some men like a prostate massage I Guess that's different than a than a finger up the asshole I mean it's part of a finger. It's it's It's a subset of fingers up the asshole.
[29:08] Mike: Um, oh for sure? Well, but I mean ah yeah, you can find porn easily where guys like appear to have much stronger orgasms when something stuck up their butt. So.
[29:21] Keith: Yeah.
[29:25] Mike: I mean that's believable to me. Um, but so okay so I mean I bet I think that answers your question if there's some is there some act where you know it's relatively common for 1 party to want to do it to the other in other words I don't think that what this guy? Okay I don't think that one like I don't think the peg peg me. So I can do anal to you is really a completely fair trade actually um because at at core you're talking about penetration and it's more ah, a male female 2 female activity than a female to male activity. Um.
[29:52] Keith: Ah, have.
[29:57] Keith: Okay, so so you think this guy should be doubly bad like not only did he make a overly generous offer in the first place but she renegged on it.
[30:04] Mike: Oh yeah, oh yeah, yeah, he should be really irritated that he space. Basically what what she did is she sort of bluffed him and then he called the bluff and he lost or what? yeah maybe that's the wrong way to describe it but like she she she tricked him. She didn't want to peg him probably but she just thought well he'll definitely say no to this.
[30:23] Keith: Right? Yes, she she's like the dog that caught the cars up there. She's like what do I do now I mean can't she say you know reasonably hey I could tell you didn't like it.
[30:24] Mike: And then you know, but but what was going on if she just didn't write that. There's another piece to this which is that he says that he has go ahead.
[30:40] Keith: Why do you want to do this thing that you know is uncomfortable to me like couldn't she sort of take this sort of higher ground position by and and say something like that.
[30:48] Mike: Because because like things. Okay, there's a difference between uncomfortable and like downright painful. There's like there's a spectrum there which I think it's fair to say and when someone is in a dominant role and someone's in a submissive role. It's often the case that the person in the submissive role.
[30:55] Keith: Yeah.
[31:07] Mike: Experiences things that are that that it's look.. There's things like spanking or tying someone Up. There's a whole spectrum of things that a man or that a more dominant person does to a more submissive person that like puts them in some kind of discomfort and so. I mean it just from from my perspective. It just falls along that spectrum. She's saying she doesn't want this kind of discomfort that's fine, but it's not like inherently problematic that he wants to do something that like is uncomfortable for her right? because that's part of the. That can be frequently part of sex play like there must be something you do you've done with partners that you enjoy that they they find uncomfortable key Really what about like I mean there there could even just be a position like for example, a lot of men like to sort of put a woman's legs.
[31:43] Keith: No nothing ever. Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's a hip opener. Yeah.
[31:54] Mike: Over her shoulders are like way back like that's not I mean try doing that. It's sort of uncomfortable. Yeah, and but but and I'm not. It's also possible for something to be kind of uncomfortable but also kind of like it because it's exciting and like you see how much your partner likes it or whatever right? and so that it could fall into that category.
[32:07] Keith: Yeah.
[32:13] Keith: Yeah I suppose do you think that like okay you know like some women have what is called Vet Vginismus. It's like this condition where their muscles tighten up sometimes. Ah.
[32:20] Mike: A.
[32:28] Keith: Um, subconsciously.
[32:29] Mike: It's true if your penis is large enough than all women you have sex with have vagines vaginismus.
[32:35] Keith: Or the experience of having vginismus. Ah so some women find penetrative sex more painful than others like it might't it be the case that some women find animalal sex substantially more painful than others.
[32:48] Mike: Definitely That's definitely right? because there are women that claim to enjoy it. They kind of like angle toward it. Um I mean that's ah, that's like well known to be a thing right? Yeah I mean it's and and people have different pain tolerances and they also experience.
[32:51] Keith: Right? And some that say that it's really painful and they hate it.
[33:04] Mike: Discomfort differently right? I mean there there are people who who like I mean look there're dudes who like to have nails nailed through their cocks or whatever they're these like crazy I mean therere people that really get in or like the yeah that there's some like they just want the like neurons stimulated or something and I think there can be the same thing for a woman and also.
[33:10] Keith: Right? Yes, some people for some people. The pain is the pleasure.
[33:23] Mike: It makes sense to me that for a woman like who's being more submissive that an act that kind of like degrades her might make it whatever puts her more submissive might give her a lot of psychological reward and so yeah for that one where whereas another ah another type of woman who's not ah.
[33:32] Keith: Um, yeah.
[33:42] Mike: As much into being submissive doesn't doesn't get it I wanted to bring up though with this guy that I also found curious. The fact that he has a fetish for anal I mean I don't I Actually I mean I am aware I'm not sure that's a thing I've had a way I've heard anal describe before someone having a fetish for it.
[33:42] Keith: Run.
[33:57] Keith: Okay, first of all I mean I don't think we should prociferrate too much about this guy's word choice on anything. But yeah, he does say he has a big anal fetish I think that just means he's wanted to trianle for a long time.
[33:59] Mike: And which it's entirely possible. It's just a little odd.
[34:07] Mike: Okay.
[34:14] Mike: Yeah I mean therere guys who have fed it who you know want somebody to take a dump on them and stuff like that. There's a lot of different kind of weird fetishes. But I actually would put I would say having a fetish about wanting to dominate makes I think it's much more common than having a fetish actually about the anus like that's a little weirder.
[34:15] Keith: That's his way of saying that.
[34:21] Keith: Yes, are.
[34:34] Keith: Yeah.
[34:34] Mike: To me which isn't to say that it doesn't exist but it's so I feel like it's somewhat less likely that he feels that way than that he just wants to be more dominant I think that if I were like giving him advice.
[34:43] Keith: Um I I'm I'm not that interested in anal sex myself. Ah, but I do occasionally like watching anal porn. It is. It's it's it feels more dominant.
[34:55] Mike: Yes, yeah, well, which which ah which part of it is more compelling to you the man or is maybe it's equal the man sort of like doing this dominant thing or the woman How submissive the woman is in that position. Yeah for me too for me too.
[35:07] Keith: I Think the latter is more like yeah um.
[35:11] Mike: Like there's there are a number of different like things that can happen in porn where it's and it's usually the thing that gets my attention is how powerless the woman is in the situation like is sort of a turn on. Yeah.
[35:19] Keith: Right? right? Yeah, um I wanted to say 1 more thing about. Okay so I think this woman could ah steal me on her renegging case by saying. Look man like you didn't like it and now you want to do this to me I think that's one way she could do it. Another thing she could point out is they shouldn't have gotten a clone of his penis. They should have gotten a penis that's ah like I don't know what her weight is and and and his weight or or his height and her height. But she probably has ah a smaller asshole than him so they should have gotten a bigger penis so that it's the same amount of discomfort.
[35:58] Mike: Do you think that men um I don't know I don't know I don't have any evidence to suggest that men's anuses are larger than women's anuses I could I could actually argue.
[36:07] Keith: Oh even if they were the same size. It might be bigger just because he's a man presumably The man is presumably. The man is bigger Anyway, they usually are but for both those reasons he should. He should have He should take a bigger.
[36:14] Mike: I understand yeah I mean the the sort of are I'm not sure that that's accurate Anatomically I'm I'm not sure it's wrong either and the reason why I'm not sure is because you know that like that.
[36:25] Keith: Bigger dick.
[36:34] Mike: That's an area of the body where women's body parts can be larger because that's where the head of the baby passes through and on the birth now and stuff like that. It's It's actually possible that a woman's that there's more I'm not I'm actually not sure I my my prior on that would be that they're the same size. My guess I Mean. Have you like I haven't looked at enough like shits that women take versus men to say oh the man's is definitively larger diameter.
[36:57] Keith: Um, my prior is definitely that the man's ah are are bigger. But yeah, but I don't know.
[37:03] Mike: So you so you think that I mean just just taking this to his logical conclusion. You think that if you if if you were some sort of ah ah proctologist I'm not sure even what I don't actually don't know what specialty would study those and you did a study where you measured the the the the turds.
[37:19] Keith: I Know where you're going here. Yeah like my answer is yes yes I think that an expert ah that this would probably be somebody works in a lab that ah does like maybe deworming studies or something they see a lot of shit and they they've.
[37:20] Mike: Of men and women that the women's turds would be smaller diameter.
[37:34] Mike: Um, right.
[37:36] Keith: You know seem a Plora plethora from from men and women. And yeah I think that they I guess Huh What? I bet on it. What I mean I I So yeah.
[37:42] Mike: Okay, so if a man and a woman. Yeah let me say 1 thing if a man and a woman men and women have around the same size mouth and oesophagus I think I'm not totally sure, but let's let me just finish if a man and a woman then ate the same amount of food or the same. Amount and kind of breakdown of food. Ah, that would mean that the man would have wider shorter turds and the woman would have narrower longer turds because there has to be the same amount of volume right? No but let's say but I mean let's say that.
[38:02] Keith: Yeah.
[38:10] Keith: Yes, but of course, yep yeah, but of course men eat more to make up for their larger science.
[38:18] Mike: You had a man and a woman who ate the same amount I had the same breakdown of fiber sugar Carba You know all those things that the way right in general the man the woman I'm I'm just imagining that the man would produce these kind of like thick logs and the woman is producing these snakes that's sort of liking. Okay.
[38:21] Keith: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, macros. Ah, yeah, right? I mean you arguing by first principles here. This is good. Um, yeah I mean you make a compelling point. Um.
[38:36] Mike: And not sure that's true.
[38:48] Keith: I mean okay on the other side I mean you allow that like people have poop signatures right? like surely um, you could tell difference 15 yours in your wives right? like if you.
[38:55] Mike: Um, what.
[39:00] Mike: I've not done any work on that in my entire life. How do you? What makes you say that do you have you done. So as there something that happened to you in your life where you've added trace Trace The poop signature of people.
[39:05] Keith: Um.
[39:13] Keith: Ah, no, but I've thought I've thought about this I mean there are people on Reddit that you know make these spreadsheets of they're speaking of things you could track by spreadsheet that you know they'll track their poops and they'll talk about you know, color and size and um ah is it consistency.
[39:19] Mike: Who yeah.
[39:29] Mike: I Don't like this at all. Yeah I don't I mean no okay, but but yeah I will grant I will grant this children obviously make smaller poops than adults and so obviously there's some relationship relationship to body size I Just think that like.
[39:29] Keith: Ah, Firmness. There's actually a scale. Let's move On. We didn't such a good job. Not talking about poop you know extensively for. Yes.
[39:48] Keith: Ah, yeah.
[39:49] Mike: The difference between a five foot five woman and a five foot say a six foot man is you know the anus size difference is going to be kind of minor but okay, you know I take your point that maybe the guy should have been pegged by a slightly larger diameter thing to but I mean it's all it's not just that like pegging is also like.
[39:51] Keith: Yeah.
[40:01] Keith: Okay I really have nothing to add here.
[40:09] Mike: Um, okay, let me this is not going to be about poop pegging has always struck me as less um fraught than actual anal sex and the reason why is because if somebody's when somebody's pegging. You. They're not actually getting any pleasure out of it. There's no urgency. Ah, to sort of like get the stimulation they need to get to orgasm if somebody's fucking your asshole and they're within the last two minutes of getting of orgasming like it's kind of hard to stop them. You know it's like it's you're put at I think more risk.
[40:38] Keith: Ah.
[40:44] Mike: I've thought that before the like I I if I had the choice between setting aside like it's really hard to set all this aside but setting aside the fact that it's a man versus a woman setting aside like get a Std risk all that kind of stuff The fact that there's semen Blah Blah Blah Blah I would still prefer being pegged by an object just because.
[40:46] Keith: Um, yeah.
[40:55] Keith: Yeah I am.
[41:00] Mike: Don't want to deal with that Urgencce that orgasm urgency happening inside my body in a tender you know a delicate orifice where it hurts that seems really fucking horrible and the risk there seems horrible. It's a definite downside to going to prison.
[41:06] Keith: Um, yeah.
[41:16] Keith: Ah, yes, amongst others? Um, yeah, let's move on. Um this person says the sex is awful I a 32 year old female thought I found the perfect guy a 50 year old male.
[41:18] Mike: Yes, tell anyway.
[41:32] Keith: A 50 year old man 32 year old woman. We met organically on a plane. We both have daughters that are the same age. We go to the same church. He supports my career and we have amazing conversations. He doesn't drink. He's hyper intelligent. He makes really good money I know that doesn't matter, but it matters. He's a little goofy and that's completely fine I need a guy that's okay with being weird.
[41:33] Mike: Nice.
[41:51] Keith: And past relationships have been Alpha Male super masculine completely full of themselves. How would you like reading that your partner was saying that you are not an Alpha male super masculine.
[42:05] Mike: That's probably what 2 people would say about me so I'm fine with it I yeah I just took that to mean alpha male to me in that.
[42:08] Keith: I Don't know. No no, you're not, You're not Alpha male super masculine. But you're not whatever the opposite of those things are being the opposite of those is anyway. Yeah I suppose not yeah, all right.
[42:15] Mike: Ok, but she isn't saying that this person's the opposite of that she's just saying that you know? yeah.
[42:25] Keith: 1 thing that I can't get over is the sex. His package is extremely small and it maybe last 30 seconds I always been a very sex forward type of person but it's been increasingly something I just don't want to do even him going downtown. Is it enjoyable does anyone else have a relationship where they aren't fulfilled sexually but it works because I don't know does it work.
[42:30] Mike: Um.
[42:44] Mike: Um, she said even him going downtown doesn't work or okay, just even going downtown.
[42:44] Keith: Ah, okay, it's that that's it's it's asked in the comments and she doesn't respond anything but it's ambiguous. She says ah. Even him going downtown isn't Enjoyable. So I guess it implies that's him going down on her.
[43:01] Mike: Yeah, that's right that makes sense. Okay, so yeah because that would be the thing that would be the saving throw right? I mean ok I mean I think I think honestly a lot of women. Okay, let's set aside micro penises like true true issue thing things there but a small penis like probably doesn't matter if the guy can.
[43:07] Keith: Yeah.
[43:21] Mike: Reliably bring her to orgasm I Don't think a woman. Well I go but I think a lot of women. We wouldn't be such a big deal. Um, yeah.
[43:26] Keith: Yeah, we've we've been through this before there are some people who consider themselves size queens but I suspect even them are probably a bit confused but there are probably some. There's some non-zero amount that like they have a requirement for a huge cock. But I think let's don't care. Yes.
[43:32] Mike: Um, sure.
[43:40] Mike: Yeah, this the penis size thing I think is mostly in the guy's head is the point. Um, unfortunately I wish it were if if if you're gay I don't think it's I think among gay men. It's much more important than it is in heterosexual situations.
[43:44] Keith: So to speak.
[43:53] Keith: Do you want bigger or smaller if you're a gay man. Jesus.
[43:58] Mike: They want bigger typically I just I just feel that way from like all of the media and like porn and stuff that I've seen of gay stuff like it seems like there's a lot of fetishizing of really just big which makes sense I mean I think that makes sense there is there is but it's that that part I look hetero Pon star it at men.
[44:09] Keith: I Mean there is an hetero porn too. But all right. Um, yeah.
[44:17] Mike: For women stuff that started at women. It's much more confusing the stuff they like is bizarre sometimes okay.
[44:25] Keith: Yeah I don't have any advice for her about the bad sex that sounds like a problem I Actually the reason why I included this is something that she almost mentioned as a throwaway she says he makes really good money I know that doesn't matter, but it matters.
[44:36] Mike: Okay. Um, yes.
[44:42] Keith: And the reason why I included this is you and I have talked a lot offline and and some on the show about ah our differing opinions on how much the man how much the man making being important to the woman and generally.
[44:52] Mike: Now.
[45:01] Keith: You think it's more important I think it's less important I think it's important I just think that it's really interesting How much women are under pressure to act like it doesn't matter to them like even in this context, she's like yeah she she she. It's obviously important to her. She brings it up. He's fifty years old she's 32 but she even has to put it this parenthetical I know that doesn't matter, but it matters because she knows that she's going to get judgment from this is this post was on two x chromosomes by the way and so.
[45:36] Mike: Um, so the the women's though the the sort of hyper Moderately hyper feminist subreddit Yeah right? Oh well. No, she could have gotten shouted down on two X chromosomes for saying that money mattered because because it's women shaming each other.
[45:40] Keith: This should have been as this should have been as safe a space as as possible. Um, and.
[45:48] Keith: I see I guess you know.
[45:52] Mike: But makes sense to me but ok, so ah, so we you want to talk about the the fact that she feels bad about caring about that. Basically yeah.
[45:59] Keith: Um, yeah, it it I don't know if she does feel bad. She she wants to virtue signal that she feels bad about or or that she acknowledges it.
[46:11] Mike: Right? I mean I think this comes down to this Question. So I understand where that comes from I mean it comes from romance. Ah, whatever you know, romantic Novels um, romantic comedy Films fairy tales like just lots and lots and lots of cultural. Stuff that tells that and I'm not sure why it's an interesting question. Actually I'm not sure why but tells women tells society that Love is love and you should women should find the person that's their soul mate or something like that right? I mean this is like and and and and it's and this is kind of cutting.
[46:45] Keith: Unha.
[46:48] Mike: The the the money thing the career thing cuts against that it's like well you know and and yeah and there's a lot of like books films you know media that that shows a woman sort of betting on the guy who's kind of a loser you know like the the movie rocky say like right I mean the whole like a lot. That's the the first movie right? A lot of it's just a love story about like how.
[47:04] Keith: Yeah.
[47:08] Mike: This woman is like devoted to this guy who's kind of a loser right? Um, in in it and it's very compelling right? It's like oh you know the people they can they can make a team and fight against anything right? and people find say like Donald Trump and Melania Trump kind of gross because it's obviously.
[47:11] Keith: Um, yeah.
[47:17] Keith: Um, yeah, yeah.
[47:26] Mike: There's like a bunch of reasons. It's gross, but like let's just take this one which is it's obviously kind of like a marriage of convenience where if she's like I'm hot. You're rich. Let's do it? yeah.
[47:26] Keith: Yeah.
[47:35] Keith: How dare you Mike Yeah I I guess I don't understand why there's so much like if you were to ask um a group of women. How important it was to them I Wonder in what context they'd I Wonder in what context, they're honest with themselves and what context they'd be honest with the ask her and in what context they would feel like they needed to virtue signal something.
[48:06] Mike: Um I saw a ah survey recently that was asking what the top traits men found in women and women found men for men and women it was kind of the obvious things. Um, but for women looking for men the number 1 thing was intelligence.
[48:20] Keith: Yeah, isn't that just that like competence and intelligence are just a proxy for wealth.
[48:22] Mike: Which I view as kind of an it's a.
[48:27] Mike: It's it's it could be a precursor though right? So I mean if you if you imagine a society like most of human history where women are selective but they're selecting men kind of young so you don't really know who's going to be successful yet. These would be the traits you would look for. Although you know if there's somebody born into a wealthy family.. That's all also a decent trait right? That's not really a trade but it's a situation that you could rely on so but that yeah so they're proxies but they're like time shifted right.
[48:50] Keith: Um, yeah yeah yeah yeah I I do see on dating apps a lot. Um women will say they're looking for a man. But some ambition with some drive and I think makes sense like I bet a lot of women these days date these men who you know live in their basement to play Xbox all day and that could be tiresome.
[49:11] Mike: Um, and.
[49:22] Mike: I mean yeah I I think I don't really know the answer to why society I mean part me part of me and I almost want to say that like these cultural artifacts are created were created by men so they're misleading to women. That's that's like a kind of a.
[49:40] Keith: Um, yeah.
[49:40] Mike: Radical feminist type argument that I don't normally like but it's It's a little hard to understand why so little of culture basically is practical advice for women saying hey you know you should find a guy that's going to be like going to actually meet the emotional need you have which is for somebody who's competent ambitious and so forth. Um.
[49:57] Keith: Um, yeah.
[49:58] Mike: And whereas for men Society's completely fine with the messaging that yeah look you want somebody that's going to be good at that has you know? ah a symmetrical face and large breasts and whatever else like the things that are associated with fecundity.
[50:07] Keith: Caretaking.
[50:10] Keith: Ah, well yeah, but but even their even their um personality traits. Um, yeah, being ah empathetic and these kinds of things are considered pluses out in the open. You don't need to like.
[50:24] Mike: Right? right? Yeah and like loyalty loyalty from a woman is also important right? So you don't get cuped but these yeah these are all kind of out in the open but like it's true and and actually it's interesting that um I mean men as you.
[50:28] Keith: Put it in a parenthetical sure. Yeah, right.
[50:42] Mike: As you know like some large number of times I've crossed swords with women who ah say that I'm too prescriptive about what women want or whatever Oh I don't understand I don't know what they what they want ah and ah some of it comes down to this where it's like I'm being too simplistic by suggesting that the things they want are. Status a guy who's high status guy who's high high ambition intelligent competent um and yet and and so it's like where does that come From. Where does their conclusion that like that's too simplistic. Come from I mean nobody has a problem with guys wanting hot chicks. Why can't there just be sort of like a simple way to at least understand it to First. Ah.
[51:03] Keith: Yes.
[51:15] Keith: Um, right right? Yeah that there's like this. Um yeah, like knee-jerk reaction against the accusation that they might like somebody that you know has a tesla or or dress as well.
[51:20] Mike: Degree.
[51:29] Mike: Right? But to be fair now. But you think it's less important than I think it is. That's yeah.
[51:31] Keith: Right? Like it's it. Ah.
[51:37] Keith: Um, well I don't know I don't know if I've ever thought it's less important I think that women's relationship with it is complicated I think a lot of women have been so gaslighted on this that they themselves believe that money doesn't Matter. It's a little bit like you know what? it's a little bit like. Even want to say this? Yeah I'm going to say it. Ah yeah, I've been at a couple companies where we've had police officers come in and speak with us and they're like if you're walking down the street or if you're in an elevator alone and somebody steps in or you see somebody that makes you feel uncomfortable just step out of the elevator or across the Street. You don't need to.
[52:13] Mike: The um.
[52:14] Keith: Um, and and what they're really saying is yeah like if you see like a black person and they seem threatening to you. It's okay to cross the street. You don't need to like do this, You don't need to do this.
[52:23] Mike: Um, whoa It could be ah it It could be a ah ah a skin head. Also.
[52:30] Keith: It could be but like okay like this whole thing gets sort of like saddled with this this racism argument. But um, people are assiduously trying not to say the thing which is yeah if you see something that like is triggering your spider sense. It's okay to like cross the street or step out of the elevator fuck.
[52:33] Mike: Okay, okay.
[52:40] Mike: Um, fair.
[52:43] Mike: Right? And people have reasonable judgments based on their knowledge of kind of who commits crime like for example, women do not commit, many violent crimes. That's that's like a safe one to say and so if you're walking down the street and a woman is a woman is walking toward you, you're probably fine if it's a man and it's late at night hey less fine right? And there's kind of a sliding scale. There. Yeah. That's that's yeah I've heard that many times.
[53:03] Keith: Yeah, maybe you're saving me from getting canceled here. But in any case, Um, where was I going with this? Yeah,, there's There's some analogy here toward women who yeah like they feel like they need to signal that they're not um, they're not. And interested in wealth or status. But ah, almost almost to the point where they believe it themselves and will do something um that will harm themselves because they're they're so busy like virtue signaling here and it seems odd to me.
[53:34] Mike: Right? You're basically saying that that like the people that know in the crime dimension and really honestly people that know in the relationship and family and life dimension tell you hey there are these basic rules. You can follow and things go much better and people will say well. But I don't want to be a stereotype.
[53:52] Keith: Yeah.
[53:53] Mike: I Don't want to stereotype I want to and that's right and in a lot of ways like romantic comedies and romance and stuff like that is oddly going against these stereotypes. Um and atite. It's I don't know I'm not sure I actually don't know what the cultural I'd have to I'd have to think for a while.
[54:04] Keith: Yeah, and.
[54:08] Mike: To come up with a theory about why culture would have come up with fairy tales and whatnot that are like that that are that are sort of cutting against the aristocracy or something.
[54:13] Keith: Yeah I mean there's there's also a ton of of fiction where it's just the standard prince or you know, wealthy man you know like ah what what is it? ah 50 shids of gray. Um these gothic romance novels where.
[54:23] Mike: That's true.
[54:28] Mike: Um, is is the 50 shades of gray guy. Rich.
[54:32] Keith: Yeah, he's like this rich bachelor Edmund. She's I don't remember what she is. She's just graduated from college or something um or let's do 1 more topic this for instance says, my boyfriend just stopped sex because I was rubbing my clit I kept going to rub it.
[54:36] Mike: A hot chick. Yeah, that sounds pretty hot. Yeah.
[54:48] Keith: During missionary because I like it and it's the easiest way to get off and he kept moving my hand. He didn't rub it himself after moving my hand and I also thought it was normal for me to help myself get off but he moved it off of me and said we're done here when I asked why he said it's because it means he's doing a bad job if I need to do that to come.
[55:02] Mike: Are.
[55:04] Keith: Explain that that's not the case at all and that he's not doing a bad job and that I love having sex with him I explain that sometimes I just like to do that because that's what the clit is there for but he's pretty upset and angry I tried to reinitiate sex but he threw his clothes on and said he isn't horny anymore. So Obviously I didn't keep trying. Long distance and he's visiting me I'm not on the couch writing a paper. He's in my room you won't come out with me says he's not hungry, but it's what Pm I feel like I've done something horribly wrong The guilt I feel is crazy I'm so upset what else can I do here so she doesn't say their ages but presumably this is a young man who.
[55:39] Mike: And a young woman I mean they're well they're in school right? She's working on a paper I mean the fact that she feels guilt. That's I mean this is just this is like insane like she should not feel guilty. He's there's something wrong with him. Ah I mean.
[55:40] Keith: Yeah, yeah, good point.
[55:47] Keith: Right.
[55:54] Mike: Inexperience could be the thing that's wrong with him. But ah yeah, that's.
[55:58] Keith: Um, I mean you see it even in you see it in porn. In fact, it's a little bit annoying and porn. Sometimes when the girl is rubbing herself like on 1 hand like I like that she's going for pleasure but on the other like it's sort of blocking the view. Um. They're they're very careful and porn to like position in such a way so you can see the point of penetration and when their hand is over there over their slit. It's kind of.
[56:15] Mike: Yeah I guess you mean when the porn is shot from like sort of over her shoulder so pointing down toward they' in the missionary position or something and she and so her wrist in hand are covering I mean if if if it's shot from the guys P O v.
[56:31] Keith: Yeah, yeah I think I do I think all things being equal. Yes I think I do.
[56:34] Mike: She wouldn't be covering very much although do you, you need you, You want the the view of that sort of upper part of the vulva there. Ok well maybe that's what this guy's problem is is he it's she's just mad because she's occluding the view. He's like look. It's not I'm kidding.
[56:50] Keith: Ah, although no I know sorry I was I was having another thought which is in actual sex I don't mind if the woman does that and it's not that I don't mind I I strongly encourage like do whatever you can to like reach an artist like.
[56:52] Mike: It's not.
[57:04] Mike: Yeah I mean the only negative about it. The only negatives about it can be 1 something involving fingernails in your cock. Okay, so yeah because and the second one is you know, depending on the position you're in like her hand might limit your penetration depth. But I mean these are minor.
[57:07] Keith: Great. Yes, yes, I'm glad you brought that out I agree.
[57:20] Keith: Yeah, well those things are true. But this yeah these are minor nets. Yeah yeah.
[57:23] Mike: Things that can be negotiated. Yeah, ah but yeah of course I mean it's like yeah I mean the guys's got it exactly wrong if the woman's masturbating while you're fucking her while you're having sex it means that she's yeah, it's awesome right? And like the in like the.
[57:31] Keith: Yeah, yeah, she feels comfortable. She's going for her own leisure. Yeah, it's really good. Yeah.
[57:43] Mike: There's only like good things coming out of that So he so discouraging that is ah a real kind of Rookie mistake or something that's strange and he also does I Guess doesn't understand that Well this is like he's a victim of certain porn and certain tropes that suggest to guys that.
[58:01] Mike: A large percentage of women get off without clitoral stimulation.
[58:02] Keith: I don't remember ever being confused about that. But maybe I was Im not a young man anymore. It's been a long time.
[58:14] Mike: Yeah I don't I don't think I was ever I mean I know I was never confused about that. But but I remember in high school ah going for the clit and women and girls being surprised in other words I remember girls who had some experience. Ah.
[58:27] Keith: Um, ah.
[58:31] Mike: Being surprised like like oh look How did you know how to do that which I nowadays I don't think a girl would say something like that I think she would know Well you you're on porn Obviously but back then yeah, like it was it was a they were pleasantly surprised. Yeah yeah.
[58:34] Keith: Yeah, ah.
[58:40] Keith: Yeah, oh that's a good point. Yeah right? No I know I I know exactly what you're saying yeah their previous experiences had been with men that had that were clueless and so coming across ah a casanova like yourself with his library.
[58:54] Mike: Um, right? Well no, it was I mean the thing one of the things that made it particularly confusing and I couldn't this is I mean I couldn't explain how I knew because it was back then in the 90 s it was considered pretty nerdy to be doing anything on a computer.
[58:58] Keith: Experience.
[59:08] Keith: Right? right.
[59:10] Mike: So I wasn't just gonna be like baby I I read about it in the dictionary or Sma or with the Encyclopedia I can't mean what are you going to say Ah, but yeah I think there was some confusion about how I knew the structure of their anatomy clearly.
[59:14] Keith: Right.
[59:22] Keith: Right.
[59:23] Mike: Ah, this is yeah this is something I think would have passed into history and and it's actually it's surprising on some level that a guy would have this confusion like that I don't like Society's sort of failing here.
[59:32] Keith: Yeah, ah there are I mean there are still men who are don't look at porn as much as we do or did I don't understand why in the day of the internet How you.
[59:41] Mike: Yeah, but.
[59:49] Mike: Do you really think that's true. What do you think? what percentage what percentage of ah teenage say 17 year olds what percentage of 17 year old boys in the United States ah use like.
[59:50] Keith: Ah, North American Nant without.
[01:00:04] Mike: I'm trying I'm trying to frame this like say use. No porn. It's really low right.
[01:00:07] Keith: Ah I don't know I I remember I had a friend in high school who told me he had never masturbated. He was kind of religious.
[01:00:16] Mike: You might have been lying because like how old was he Why did why did that come up. Why did that come up. Oh well I understand but I'm just curious like what? what.
[01:00:22] Keith: Ah, did a 17 or so maybe 16 I don't want to give identify details actually. Ah yeah, maybe we were in a we were in a we were on a school trip and.
[01:00:34] Mike: General kind of situation between teenage boys could arise k to a prost like to 1 on the boss or something you were where.
[01:00:40] Keith: Ah, no, no, we were like all talking about it and yeah, he yeah I guess he no he offered that he never had.
[01:00:52] Mike: Okay, you were just like walking around on a field trip and then somebody was like hey what do you guys? think about beaten off. Okay and but and there were 4 of you in the other the rest of you were like oh yeah I beat off. Okay, so.
[01:00:57] Keith: Something like that. Sure yeah and then and then he offered that he never had to the group or there were 4 of us. Yes, of course we were. We were like 17 We weren't 14 demurred.
[01:01:11] Mike: So I don't yeah when I was in high school people would have I think even at 17 I think we would have like in high school been kind of. We would know we would have not admitted to beating off I remember very specifically.
[01:01:24] Keith: Ah, yeah, maybe I'm maybe I'm miss. Maybe I'm misremembering I do specifically remember ah this person announcing that he had never masturbated.
[01:01:33] Mike: Yeah I remember very specifically with the two girls I had sex with in high school. Not with both of them being not masturbating or even rubbing my penis in front of them I remember that I remember like getting to college and then like that changing.
[01:01:51] Keith: Huh.
[01:01:51] Mike: Like not being embarrassed anymore. But like I I didn't want to imply to them that I knew how to masturbate which is preposterous of course but like these these are like these hangups people have so so I I think it's possible that he just didn't want to like I put it this way if I had been that fourth memory your group I might have.
[01:01:55] Keith: Right? Yeah, of course, right? right.
[01:02:09] Mike: It would depend on what the other people said if the 3 people said yes I would have said yes if I had to go first though I might have said pass or something.
[01:02:11] Keith: Yeah I I Just don't remember I remember for a long time wondering if he'd ever. Let's assuming he hadn't actually ever masturbated if he had ever had a wet dream like had he ever even had an orgasm.
[01:02:27] Mike: You wondered that for a long time. You should call him up.
[01:02:29] Keith: Like does the body I mean I still kind of wonder like what happens if you if you just stop mastur beating. Do you I could I could reach out on Facebook.
[01:02:41] Mike: Yes, you that this was all right? You'd already started your unbroken streak of days or whatever weeks with ah at least 1 orgasm or something that continues to this day. Okay.
[01:02:47] Keith: He has he has at least 1 child now. So that implies he's had an orgasm. Ah there there are other ways there are other ways all right. That's that's enough for this this.
[01:02:56] Mike: It it does although it could have there are other you know adoption and so forth. But no, you look. He's probably yeah, moved off of that. Yeah, all right.
[01:03:06] Keith: Sort of your biage bay vary. You can send us feedback or questions to ymmvpod at Gmail.com we pay $10 for feedback. So just give us your venmo or Paypal and any feedback and we'll give you ten bucks ah and if you send us a question. Let us know if you don't want to want us to use it on the air. We appreciate your time. Thanks for listening and we'll catch you next week on your mileage may vary.

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Episode 142: Soul Mate Seeking, Pegging Agreements, Small Packages, Female Self-Pleasuring During The Act

Episode Transcript