Your Mileage May Vary: Lube Lessons, Older Meets Younger, Condom Presumption, Male Eruptions

Episode Transcript

Transcript automatically generated by a robot. Apologies for any inaccuracies.

[00:00] Keith: Hello and welcome to your mileage may vary. We talk about sex and relationships with frankness that is often controversial but mostly in good faith today's list of salacious topics include a man offended by his date having condoms more on semen volume. Whether penises can materially grow and more. And Keith my cohost is Mike hello Mike um I was thinking on my walk today I'm I'm still walking I'm not running yet post covid and I was thinking about lubrication and I've slept with a number of women and I can't remember.
[00:22] Mike: Um, Hello keith.
[00:38] Keith: Any of them like requiring Lube have you been with women that you know more often than not require lube.
[00:47] Mike: I have not but I did have a partner in college where we had kind of several times when Condoms broke and the conclusion that was drawn was that it was because of lack lack of lubrication on her end. Um.
[01:01] Keith: Ha.
[01:03] Mike: Yeah, so I mean that's that's a that I can't remember whether the solution was to use lubrication or if we like broke up before that I'm not sure about that I just I remember I suppose distinctly remember like and the way I remember it. Ah so how you know how would I know that was what was happening.
[01:11] Keith: Ah, yeah.
[01:19] Mike: The way I knew was that the condom would sort of bunch up toward the base of my cock right? So that suggested that it was like getting dragged down on the inf the inward thrust and then like it would wind up like a would get sort of uncomfortable because like you're the head of your cock would be sort of pushed against it like a balloon.
[01:24] Keith: Um, yeah I see what you're saying.
[01:35] Keith: Right? Huh I've not had that experience I've used condoms plenty but I can't remember an experience where they weren't lubricated enough or they were.
[01:37] Mike: And then ultimately it would break and you would feel it now.
[01:54] Keith: Or even the condom like shifting around on my on my penis Anyway I.
[01:56] Mike: Yeah, it could also be like lubrication on the man's side or like too much precom or something like that I'm not totally sure what was happening there. But.
[02:02] Keith: Yeah I guess I brought this up because you constantly read on the sex subreddit people talking about you know use lubrication. It's it's you know, really important and not everybody like naturally produces lubrication and you know it's like it's like a. Super common tip. There was a topic on the sex subred at this week or last week about like hacks for sex like you know what are some good things that you know people don't know and I think the number one was number one one was lubrication and it just sort of got me thinking like I can't. Remember it ever really being an issue I've used it before like I've been with people I'm thinking of 1 person in particular who really liked coconut oil. Um and but like she used it copiously just to like moisturize her skin and so she had sort of like a.
[02:53] Mike: Um, okay.
[03:02] Keith: Coconut oil obsession. So I don't think it was no in fact, ah it gets quite warm with friction. So I remember when we would use it. It was almost like too warm. Yeah I didn't.
[03:02] Mike: Did you have to warm it up first.
[03:12] Mike: Hu it's like a it's a voice. It's preventing or what is it. It's like insulating. It's keeping the temperature in there I mean generally the point of a lubricant I mean in a in a car engine or something like that is to decrease temperature right.
[03:21] Keith: I Guess yeah I guess um.
[03:31] Mike: I Mean ultimately you're reducing friction. So so it's a little odd that you'd have a lubricant that would increase friction. Although maybe you were just another point I would make is I don't want to bust your burst your bubble here. But another point I would make is that ah wouldn't I mean who do you think.
[03:32] Keith: Right? Yeah, maybe I'm maybe I'm misremembering.
[03:43] Keith: Yeah I knew this is coming.
[03:51] Mike: Between the male and the female who do you think would experience the downsides of lack of lubrication more? yeah.
[03:52] Keith: Right? right? right? Of course. Yeah it could be that I'm like imposing this super high friction uncomfortable sex on a bunch of women could be um, but I mean I don't want to reveal how many people I've slept with but certainly with all my long term partners lubrication and. Was never an issue and they would have brought it up I'm I'm sure. In fact, we've had it and I've asked like you know I don't think that's it I think you think that women are having uncomfortable sex with me.
[04:13] Mike: Um, yeah I mean it makes more sense I mean this I.
[04:24] Mike: Oh I do I think that I think that short I think that if I think that there are ah a lot of things that happen I think that I think there are a number of physical. Physical frankly reasons why a lot of times or somewhat frequently women don't like to have one night stands or sex before the nth date and it's not just it would it would be the physical analog. Let's imagine that as a guy if you had sex on the first date you had trouble getting it up.
[04:44] Keith: Um, yeah, yeah.
[04:52] Keith: M.
[04:55] Mike: Yeah that's not true for a guy but you could imagine a universe where it was true for whatever reason and I think that's what women something like that is what women experience now for women unfortunately or perhaps fortunately not getting it up doesn't prevent the sex act from happening. But I think there is so there's some set of physical discomfort. Associated with having sex early and I mean it's really common. For example, this? um I guess prostitute that I often get on Tiktok she's in Australia she was most recently she she tries to position herself as kind of like this high end escort that makes a lot of money on what she calls her spicy page but it's.
[05:25] Keith: Um, ah.
[05:32] Mike: You know it's probably presumably ah only fans most recently her video was she was like in this place. It looks like some sort of weird shanty like it sounded like a truck stop or something and she's like yeah this is a great place to meet clients and I was thinking like me. Maybe you're not as high end as I thought you were I've I've never investigated her rates or anything I Just ah.
[05:32] Keith: Oh.
[05:43] Keith: Of cheese. Yeah.
[05:51] Mike: See her tiktoks while I'm doing my planks in the evening in any event. She basically always uses lube like she talks about this and that makes sense to me because she's not at all attracted to the guy. So there's some sort of curve of attraction that a woman has to the guy and if it's below a certain level and the thing is that.
[05:52] Keith: Protect.
[06:10] Mike: Even if you're an awesome dude on the first date. It's likely it's not going to be at that level right.
[06:16] Keith: So let's say for a moment I'm I'm going with your theory here which is that ah I've been having dry sex with women against their against their desires. How but the stick to.
[06:19] Mike: A.
[06:28] Mike: Um, not exactly it's that they want to they want to proceed further okay go on. You're not raping them or something. Yeah, yeah.
[06:31] Keith: That yeah I got it ah of course not but like 1 shouldn't I be able to tell that it's drier than normal and 2 Well let's start with that.
[06:43] Mike: With a condomon. Um I mean first of all, you probably use condoms that have some amount of lubrication on them right? So there is that so that you you actually are using lub and I'm not sure I'm not I'm not actually sure how much lub is on a condom and and how effective it is I don't I've never studied that.
[06:49] Keith: Yes.
[06:56] Keith: Um, yeah yeah I have sex for the first time without condom sometimes if we've both been tested.
[07:03] Mike: So that makes a difference. Um, and.
[07:09] Mike: Yeah I don't know if a guy would notice that that much and I think I think that the female parts would be more sensitive to that because the male parts are already going to be a little more I mean well I don't know what amount of Lube you use on your hand when masturbating I use none.
[07:23] Keith: Okay, okay so your answer is I might not be able to tell okay and 2 is what could I say or do to offer lubrication.
[07:26] Mike: So.
[07:31] Mike: You might not care.
[07:39] Mike: Oh you could? Um, yeah I bet you if you are probably but I mean it's it might I'm I'm not sure I mean how so to I mean but like do you.
[07:40] Keith: Just say do you want to use Lube She can write you'll down there and tell.
[07:53] Keith: Yeah, yeah I mean my to my recollection. My experience is that usually the woman is generatd not usually always the woman is generating enough lubrication I understand that this sounds ridiculous. That's why I'm bringing this up like I'm wondering if I'm doing something wrote.
[07:56] Mike: You tell me? So what do you do you sort of.
[08:05] Mike: Okay. But how do you judge that.
[08:12] Keith: Reliably wrong here. Ah I feel like if there weren't enough it would feel. Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's some amount beneath which I think I would think it wasn't enough. No no, no to my to my fingers.
[08:26] Mike: Um, feel to your penis to your hand to your yeah I don't know I mean maybe um, it's an interesting question. What like is it is is the problem that women experience I mean I I definitely feel like I've read that women. Ah. There could be a problem where it kind of runs out so there's a certain base amount of lubrication. But once you've had sex for a little while it sort of runs out so you might not notice that I think that yeah the the the the the test here would be if there was some not creepy way.. It's not any creepier than say.
[08:47] Keith: Um, yeah, okay I.
[09:02] Mike: Getting a condom out though you know it's like that. The only creepiness to it is. It's that you're prepared for sex. You know, having like a dispenser of lube on your like bet nights stand is not great.
[09:02] Keith: Right.
[09:09] Keith: Yeah, um I think there's different kinds of lube too. There's water based and there's oil based and I think some women women and silicon based yeah and I think some women prefer 1 kind over others.
[09:19] Mike: Um, and Silicon based.
[09:25] Mike: I Think water base would probably be the least noxious. Although I think it's also the least ah it lasts. It doesn't last as long.
[09:31] Keith: Right? But like what does the upstanding gentleman do here does he have all 3 and then offer all 3 and and like do I also need coconut oil I had a partner as I said before who preferred that.
[09:44] Mike: You're not going to like the answer I mean the upstanding gentleman like doesn't have sex with the woman on like date 1 I see.
[09:52] Keith: Okay, for starters I rarely have sex on date one I'm normally the person ah pulling on the raids.
[09:58] Mike: Well that that could explain why the lubrication is less of a problem than ok.
[10:02] Keith: Yes I want to believe here Mike that I am always in a position where the woman is attracted enough to me that she's generating lubrication but I well yeah I know that people on the sex subright it would be like look that that can't be like as there's.
[10:10] Mike: Um, that might be.
[10:19] Mike: Um, no it. It could be if you're always having sex on like date 3 4 5 where the woman's super comfortable then yeah of course it could be. You know that? Well they're just they've gotten the thing is that the female attraction to a man because men aren't as physically attractive as women and women are not.
[10:19] Keith: Surely.
[10:24] Keith: And they and they know how great I am.
[10:36] Mike: As attracted to fills a physicality as men are it's like takes longer for a woman to sort of feel comfortable with a guy than vice versa. No I mean on some level but she's still not. She's still not going to be. You know she's not going to know whether she wants to have sex with you after like an hour of talking to you.
[10:40] Keith: Okay, it's It's not my chiseled physique.
[10:52] Keith: Yeah, yeah, I've only done that I don't know if I've ever had sex with somebody within an hour I'm sure I haven't probably probably within probably like 3 hours
[10:56] Mike: Yeah.
[11:01] Mike: Um, really, what's your shortest shortest. Okay.
[11:10] Keith: I've had 2 one night stands where I like met someone at a bar and then we went back to my place and I think maybe it was 3 or 4 hours yeah
[11:16] Mike: Ah, it's always you always your place. Yeah, that's still a fairly long time I mean you can imagine I'm sure it's well I mean look for an escort. It's probably typically 30 minutes 15 minutes
[11:28] Keith: Yeah, yeah, measureing minutes or seconds.
[11:33] Mike: Right? By the way on that Tiktok. The lady in Australia said that she'd already had 3 clients that day which was just yeah, it's not it made the tiktok less compelling I mean she's attractive in stuff. But it's like look I mean I just feel sort of bad for client number 4
[11:39] Keith: Ah.
[11:50] Mike: Much less client number 9
[11:50] Keith: Um, is that the way is that the way to maximize money like let's say you're exceptionally attractive is it is the best way to go try and find a whale and just have like 1 partner and something like a sugar daddy relationship where you like eventually coax him into giving you.
[11:55] Mike: Are.
[12:07] Keith: 6 figures a year or is it better and and maybe right and and then there's some downside risk that you won't find that person so you'll have to go through a lot of people to maybe find that that whale someday or is it better to be more of the classic sex worker where you know you're having sex with. With John's and short term engagements but you know you could you can charge pretty much the most that anyone in that sort of arena can charge and it's it could be more reliable like like what is the yeah.
[12:40] Mike: What's the goal though. What's the what's the optimization function is it is that you're trying to get as much money in the shortest period of time is it that you're trying to get the most life satisfaction the least kind of crappy. Yeah I mean obviously the I mean the the evolved behavior of women. Ah culturally evolved I guess.
[12:47] Keith: Yeah, yeah, there's safety also as ah as a concern.
[12:58] Mike: Is probably the optimal one to find a partner that will sort of fund your life and your kids that will take responsibility for you and fix the light bulbs and stuff like that.
[13:08] Keith: But that might be the ah thing with like the highest Median Score Um, but it could be that there are other strategies that have a higher average I don't know. Yeah.
[13:20] Mike: Higher average than Median that's hard to figure out. Um, but in. But if you if you say that she has to be sort of escorting she she says she's decided that she doesn't want to pursue a long term partner or something like that then I tend to agree with.
[13:25] Keith: It is.
[13:36] Keith: Presumably effectively nobody wants to escort. They do that because they think it's optimizing something. Um, yeah, would we'd get yelled at for saying that. But.
[13:38] Mike: Yeah.
[13:46] Mike: That's probably right.
[13:51] Keith: Ah, in the main I Think what I said is true.
[13:52] Mike: Yeah I think that's probably right and and I do think that if you're going to be in that direction. I mean I've said this before that I think sugaring is probably smarter because yeah, you you get a smaller surface area of various things male that you're being exposed to and you probably get. More money more positive things in your life because you can then identify the 1 guy like I think there's a huge like 80209010 rule there just like there is for cam girls that there's some. There's some guys that are much better and you're avoiding like the guys that are just going to pay you a couple hundred dollars and pump and dump.
[14:21] Keith: Um, yeah.
[14:29] Mike: As they say.
[14:29] Keith: yeah yeah I think that's right okay, can we pull this back to lubrication really quickly and then we'll move on should I be offering lube on let's say I've been on a date with somebody ah 5 times.
[14:35] Mike: Um, sure.
[14:46] Keith: And she's back at my place and we've we've had you know our fifth good date together and during the course of foreplay. It feels like she's quite wet. Do I ah and let's say.
[14:46] Mike: Ah.
[15:02] Keith: This particular case we've we've both been Std tested and we've decided to have condomless sex do I offer Lube Do I have it visible somewhere so she could opt in like like what should I be? What is the proper thing to do here.
[15:18] Mike: I Don't know I mean the the risk you run. Yeah, the risk you run is appearing skeezy right? because if you have yeah.
[15:20] Keith: Maybe our listeners can can write in and let us know. Yes, we have a we have a topic about this later that where a woman has a condom and the guy is turned off by it. Yeah.
[15:35] Mike: Yeah, So it's that kind of thing. There's also the reality that she could bring something with her although it's this is one of these topics that is fraught on from both directions right? The woman might not want to so suggest. It either and she might decline because she doesn't want you to get the impression that she's not excited to sort of complicate it right.
[15:57] Keith: Yeah, yeah, it's a little bit like a man not getting hard like because a lot of men maybe rightfully so think that women are generally wet when they're excited.
[16:09] Mike: Sure what do you think about it when there's a porn and the man spits on the woman's vagina like just actually spits This is a common thing in porn.
[16:17] Keith: Yeah, okay, you can use Saliva you know, like on the tip of your penis to to create some lube The the spitting on the vagina thing I think is just a act of dominance.
[16:23] Mike: Um, sure.
[16:31] Mike: Okay, do you frequently find that you need to put Saliva on the tip of your penis and if so how do you apply it.
[16:39] Keith: No, ah I've had partners apply their own Saliva on the tip of my penis with their hand so they'll like lick their fingers and then that's it this happened like once or twice.
[16:46] Mike: With their mouth or with their hand or both.
[16:55] Mike: Um, okay, and you never do that.
[16:58] Keith: Ah, no I don't.
[17:02] Mike: Um, even if you like go to enter and it sort of feels like it's tugging a bit that never happens. Okay.
[17:08] Keith: Um, okay I know I guess I have I guess I have.
[17:14] Mike: And you you always use your saliva You don't like reach up to her mouth and get her saliva.
[17:17] Keith: I Have not done that I have seen that in porn though. Yeah, or maybe it feels more inclusive too.
[17:20] Mike: Yeah, it feels more dominant right? He's like look you you provide it. That's a thing I mean you like so on some level that is a lubricant that you have readily available.
[17:33] Keith: Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, but okay I I guess I Just don't understand. Okay, if you are a woman who often struggles. Let's let's say there are women who. Generally have lubrication issues would this be like a problem all of the time to the extent that like they probably should carry luprint lubricant with them because like most men are probably like me where they don't offer and so either they're just having uncomfortable initial sexual encounters all the time.
[17:50] Mike: Sure.
[18:07] Mike: Um I think women often have uncomfortable initial sexual encounters. You know I do yeah.
[18:09] Keith: Or I know you do Yeah, you're going. You're going to bring that color to to everything here. Yeah.
[18:19] Mike: I Mean so they so this would just fall into the category of that is they're self-conscious and they don't want to have this change the relationship.
[18:21] Keith: Ok, but then I I mean I've had many partners where we've had 10 plus sexual encounters wouldn't sometimes during the eighth encounter or whatever once they get like more comfortable with me wouldn't they bring it up if this were like ok.
[18:35] Mike: Yes, yes, there's like some natural point.
[18:41] Keith: So either there I've been with a lot of women who are always uncomfortable or this isn't as much of a thing as we're led to believe or I'm hyper attractive. Yeah, right.
[18:47] Mike: Well or you have a personality that makes it No oh wait. No you said they're always uncomfortable. Yeah, it could be because they're reluctant to bring things up like this to you So I mean one could ask are there other things. Yeah.
[18:57] Keith: But I'm not I I can imagine women being reluctant to bring things up like like this with some people but I I feel like I'm more approachable than most I don't know.
[19:08] Mike: Yeah, okay, yeah, then maybe you just not having that issue. You've got you've lucked out. Well it's good.
[19:17] Keith: Um, or maybe it's not as big of an issue as ah.
[19:20] Mike: It's a big. It's a really big issue for the people who experience it just like erectile like I don't know what the actual base rate of say for a 30 year old man of erectile dysfunction is it's probably quite low. But.
[19:23] Keith: Sure Yeah, but whenever whenever somebody brings it up. They say how normal it is and how they shouldn't be concerned at all and like it's it's It's just hard to know what the reality is you know? okay.
[19:33] Mike: Yeah, it's a noisy minority. That's right? Yeah I mean you know evolutionarily It doesn't make a whole whole like it makes sense that women would produce lubrication. Ah yeah, so it's it's not because they ultimately like. Mother nature wants to encourage them to have sex so making it super painful wouldn't be smart.
[19:55] Keith: Right? Yeah, all right? This segues into the the condom girl. Ah, she says he asked me why I had condoms Met this guy in a dating app after talking for a few days. We met up and things ended up getting heated.
[20:02] Mike: Um, turn.
[20:09] Keith: Asked me if I wanted him to grab a condom and I said sure I have some if you want me to get 1 My bag was way closer to us than his dresser. He then responded with why do you have condoms I sort of just looked at him confused and I said what do you mean to which he repeated himself meanwhile. At this point he starts getting soft I was like I don't know why do you have condoms.
[20:17] Mike: Are.
[20:28] Keith: Sometimes guys don't have them so I try to be prepared. Why is it so weird to men when females have condoms I always get this reaction. Do I seem like a horror something for having some on hand genuinely confused I think I'm being responsible l o l but maybe it comes off differently to men like sorry I don't want to get an std I've been in situations where men try to. Use not having 1 is an excuse to fuck raw yeah, but yeah, so then so from then on I started carrying some also just to note this was a brand new box that I opened in front of them since I went there knowing we were probably going to have sex. Ah yeah I don't think she should be confused by this. It is that it makes her seem more promiscuous and.
[21:03] Mike: Right.
[21:06] Keith: That that she's right. It's not fair it. It's a double standard but that's what's going on.
[21:09] Mike: Um, it it is fair I mean that's I don't agree that she's right about that I mean so so the yes, it's she. Ah yeah, the guy wants to have um some kind of illusions the wrong word but like some kind of worldview about.
[21:13] Keith: Go on.
[21:27] Mike: Women and the woman he's selecting there in particular that she is kind of somewhat chaste. He wants to be the one that pops the balloon so to speak. Um, which is not to say that like he insists she be a virgin or something but it's it's tilting that direction. Um, and it just has to do with like.
[21:31] Keith: Yep.
[21:43] Mike: He wants her to have chosen him, not 100 different guys and so when you have a woman going around deploying her sexuality in a way that feels like the way men do it. It kind of grosses out guys and the the reason why it's is fair is that I mean as we discussed before it's much easier for a woman to find a partner than a man in general.
[21:51] Keith: Yes I.
[22:02] Mike: And so a woman deploying her sexuality has a very different meaning and it just does like objectively does because it's because it's the the difficulty of finding a partner so different.
[22:07] Keith: Um, yeah.
[22:11] Keith: Right for a man to find a sexual partner is is more and of an achievement and so.
[22:20] Mike: Yes, and he has to he can't a man ah particularly say like an average attractiveness man who has like an average income or a median income whatever in a median city in America if he's offered sex by a woman. He can't really turn it down. Because in his entire life. This is I mean this is the thing that women maybe don't understand is that I think they can so maybe intellectually understand it but they don't emotionally understand this that in the average median man in his entire life. He probably has between 5 and 20 women offer sex to him not for money.
[22:55] Keith: That might be high. Yeah.
[22:57] Mike: Something like that. Well I was just trying to be like broad in my range but it's like not it's yeah, it's whereas the average woman in the median city blah blah blah blah blah in America it's like 10000 and when I say offer I just mean like well. Yeah yeah.
[23:10] Keith: What's it's effectively infinity.
[23:14] Mike: Yeah, when I say offer I just mean like it's available like the guy I've won by the way I've wondered this before I mean ah you you may have wondered it too. Maybe our listeners have wondered it like how many women in your life that you've interacted with would have had sex with you meaning? ah. It would be interesting to like see the let's say that the universe is a simulation and so there's some great computer in the sky. It'd be interesting to go into that computer and see how many times the the boolean of the woman for me was true. Yes, and you know it could be someone you talked to on the subway or at a restaurant or whatever and I'm just sort of and you know it's not 0.
[23:37] Keith: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, flip to true. Yeah.
[23:53] Mike: Right? No, you know what? I mean though I mean I mean for women who you just had a casual encounter and that was it.
[23:54] Keith: Yeah, well I've had sex. Consensually, Oh yeah, yeah, no I think I think for me in particular, it's probably higher than the average average man. Um, but it's still.
[24:05] Mike: Um, sure.
[24:10] Keith: Depressingly low.
[24:12] Mike: It's low, but but I think it would be interesting to want to know? yeah because I suspect there are there are a lot of situations where you were just like standing in line at a Walgreens or something and there's a woman there who is like oh yeah I would have sex with him or you talked to her briefly and she's like huh and then you just.
[24:13] Keith: It would be fascinating. Yeah I agree. Yeah yeah. Yeah I mean there's some downside. It could be lower than you would imagine but gosh.
[24:28] Mike: Moved on. Well, That's the other thing. Maybe it's actually 0 Maybe Basically this is part of it. It's like it's like how much of the surface area of like the winning surface area or have I managed to capitalize on yeah capture Exactly yeah, what would you guess for you? What percentage of the.
[24:43] Keith: Capture. Yeah, ah yeah.
[24:51] Mike: Available women to you. It's for you. You think the number is pretty small I bet.
[24:52] Keith: Yeah I read I reject sex even when I know it's available to me sometimes ah but I'm I'm I'm weird. No no, no, no, no, no, no, it's probably like I don't think I mean look I mean decent looking person I don't think.
[24:57] Mike: So you're going to think like under 1% or something even for you. Okay.
[25:12] Keith: When I go to Starbucks and see speak articulately or say something clever to the cashier. Yeah I don't think that's enough for almost all women to ever flip to true like they need more than that and so then you're getting into like.
[25:28] Mike: Um, what if you like went to the bank and what.
[25:30] Keith: Yeah, but now yes, but now you're getting into a much smaller set of interactions and so yeah, like I said ah.
[25:35] Mike: I was going to say if you're like at the bank and you're depositing some massive check or something like does that flip some bits. Yeah I've wondered that before.
[25:42] Keith: Ah, oh I wonder I wonder Yeah bank tellers aren't typically super attractive. Yeah, that's true to right.
[25:51] Mike: And also they see that kind of behavior way more than the average person so they might just be like oh here's another one of these you know or in it's like oh this could just be paying off a mortgage or like moving around some refinance money your way. Anyway, this is not interesting. But yeah.
[26:04] Keith: Right? It's it's less less impressive to them. Yeah, all right? Let's move on to this. What is this semen volume. Yeah, we talked about semen volume in passing last episode. Ah, my boyfriend comes massively after having sex with me. Boyfriend and I have amazing sex and our chemistry is out of this world something we've noticed is that every time he comes after doing it with me. It's a lot. He says that never happens to him and I've never had that experience with another guy. We're both interested in knowing what the possible reason could be and can't find anything online about it. This happened to you and what was the reason. She's a 25 year old female. Ah I look I think people are not good at estimating their seeming volume like the first response I always come twice as much from sex than from masturbation but sex usually less twenty plus minutes will masturbation rarely more than 5 so maybe that's the reason I just don't. Trust his judgment here. Yeah.
[27:01] Mike: How would you know I mean I think we you and I've discussed this that like you kind of I eyeball the condom or something if you're not using a condom. It would be impossible to know I think we can agree unless you're like shooting loads on her stomach right.
[27:06] Keith: Yeah, yeah, yeah I joked that they I joked they could put hash parks on the condom so people could see there. Yeah, thank you.
[27:19] Mike: Not a bad idea actually then yeah ah you could have Mr. Mr. Beast I saw a Mr Beast candy bar in the store this morning now you could have him sell condoms too. Oh for sure. Ah, but yeah I don't ah.
[27:26] Keith: Yeah, that guy I bet he flips some bits.
[27:39] Mike: I mean I think it's more but I don't know how you would measure it in any sort of systematic way and if you're producing I think the more you're producing the harder. It would be to measure it I mean oh just because it kind of goes everywhere like when I've seen kind of really large amounts of semen in porn often shot on like girls' Butts or stomachs you just don't.
[27:47] Keith: Why how you yeah like if it's fine.
[27:57] Keith: Yeah, but I mean my own semen has like different textures and thicknesses and and what what is it obscurity a translucentness and like I just think without an actual actual you know.
[27:58] Mike: It's not clear what's going on.
[28:08] Mike: Um, okay I think I Ah I.
[28:15] Keith: Measuring device. It's It's hard to objectively know and so I definitely don't trust this woman saying like oh yeah, he's he's coming so much more I mean she wants to think that he wants her to think that and so that may or may not be happening now. The premise that people ah come more. With more intense orgasms than with less intense orgasms that seems possible but like what is even the mechanism there.
[28:42] Mike: Well I mean more ah contractions. Um I mean that it I think there is some correlation between the amount and ah length of the sex session and how much semen you produce.
[28:51] Keith: Yeah, somebody said yeah the longer you edge the more you come is that true like if you like it is your body just sort of like slowly proxying it up and getting it ready.
[28:56] Mike: Yeah.
[29:04] Mike: I think I think to some extent although I what what? I've read is that the most reliable factor is how long it's been since you last or ejaculated which makes sense and and that has definitely been my personal experience right.
[29:15] Keith: Yes, that that definitely makes sense I mean that.
[29:22] Mike: So people could and that's so that's like a confounding thing like maybe this guy I mean a couple things this guy obviously look if if I had a partner who was like oh wow you you nut a lot I would definitely I would steer into that one and be like oh yeah, let's let's talk about this a lot. Let's let's make a big deal out of it because I'm going to get to nut more.
[29:31] Keith: Um, yeah, me too.
[29:40] Keith: Right.
[29:41] Mike: That partner and like anything that makes a woman interested in the guy's sexual response Cycle Turns a guy on he's like great this is This is the best thing. Ah and I'm not going to dissuade her I'm not going to say I mean you're you're never going to say to a well I came more with my last partner.
[29:48] Keith: Um, yeah.
[29:55] Keith: Right? She she says that he said that never happens to him and that he's never and she says she's never had that experience with another guy like they're both. Yeah it a sign like a thirty or forty percent truthiness to to either of those statements like it's that they're highly incentive. But.
[29:59] Mike: Sure.
[30:11] Mike: Um, right right? Yeah, it's interesting to me that a woman would perceive this positively. Um I mean I guess there's yeah, that's a little bit interesting to me, especially in giving oral.
[30:14] Keith: Incentivized to lie. Um.
[30:24] Keith: Why now makes sense to me. Well ok I know we're going here but before we go there. Yeah, she wants to imagine that he's more aroused and therefore generating larger loads because of her.
[30:28] Mike: Does. Um, yes.
[30:40] Mike: Okay, but I think that that I think she could get the same cues. Yeah yeah I mean you want like if the choice was a thimble for or a thimbleful or a cup of steaming semen in my mouth I would pick the thimble full every time.
[30:44] Keith: You're going to say the practicality of the larger load is is limited. In fact, possibly negative. Why? so.
[30:59] Mike: And I think most women would too The yeah.
[30:59] Keith: Mike you've told me many times that women like like it when men come in their mouths now now now you're now you're putting some barriers on this, you're saying that it can't be that much.
[31:05] Mike: Sure a normal amount.
[31:14] Mike: Well I mean people like ah ah, frosting on their cake. But if you put too much. They get that weird tingling sensation in their mouth or whatever like they're things. There's there's limits to all good things right? like this is thanks. Yeah.
[31:23] Keith: Um, good analogy even there even this same color is good. Ah huh? Yeah, okay I mean I don't want to have a man come in my mouth and.
[31:35] Mike: A.
[31:38] Keith: But and I definitely don't want them to come more in my mouth. So so that makes sense to me. But yeah, like if I liked come in my mouth. Maybe more would be better I don't I don't know it's like it's like it's like demonstrating to me how excited they are.
[31:48] Mike: I Don't think so.
[31:55] Mike: I I think there's like a pretty clean limit there. And yeah I think the main thing is like their their reaction I mean for example on the ah chick flicks subreddit. They're always looking for guys that moan like they want the they want. Yeah they I don't this amount of semen never is the thing they're looking for.
[31:59] Keith: There's an upper pound with diminishing returns. Ah yeah.
[32:12] Keith: Moaning was ah was one of the tips on the ah Hacks sex Hacks things things you should do and it's like men. You don't need to be that good at Sexy talk just moan just give some sort of positive feedback to the woman. That's all they want.
[32:12] Mike: Which makes sense to me.
[32:26] Mike: That's that's right that makes sense because and and yeah and that's I mean this absolutely silent guy sort of bums out women because they're not getting how much feedback and the concrete feedback of the semen volume is not going to not going to be the.
[32:27] Keith: You've seen that on chicklix too.
[32:41] Keith: Okay.
[32:43] Mike: Think so the point is this woman if he just was more like more demonstrative with her than she was used to or something like that then that's sufficient and I mean but whatever. He's obviously like Lee's leaning into this because that's what any normal guy would do I mean yes, the answer is yes.
[33:00] Keith: Do you think that? Okay, let's say you knew your average masturbating come amount. Could you do something other than waiting longer than you normally do ah to amp things up amp up the the volume in some way.
[33:01] Mike: Let's seemen.
[33:16] Mike: I Mean the only things I know are things I've read from like porn stars. There's certain like Niacin or something. There's certain that's probably wrong. There's certain like well there's supplements. You can take that I think made I mean I've never I don't know I mean I.
[33:17] Keith: Could you edge yourself.
[33:24] Keith: There's Stephen Max from the Pornhub ads yeah I'm sure those I'm sure those are legit come on. Yeah come on man.
[33:34] Mike: Probably not yeah being well hydrated. Um, maybe maybe ah getting pegged would increase increase it I could imagine it decreasing it because I've thought this before that if you have something up your butt. It might interfere with like the.
[33:36] Keith: Yeah.
[33:45] Keith: Um, yeah.
[33:53] Mike: Ah, contractions or something somehow like it might change your body's yeah ability to sort of like contract the muscles around the prostate because now there's something in there. It might also improve it. But I'm just not sure.
[33:55] Keith: Um, I see what you're saying yeah I hear.
[34:02] Keith: Right? It could I would expect it to be a non-zero effect I don't know if it'd be positive or negative.
[34:09] Mike: Right? This sounds like something you could test out for our listeners. Okay, okay I'm not either. So.
[34:15] Keith: I'm not going to do that I gonna keep my virgin asshole virginal vert virgined for Virgin Lee what's the ah adjective I guess just virgin. Okay, all right.
[34:28] Mike: Um, yeah, virginal virginal.
[34:33] Keith: This person says my boyfriend's dick grew.dotdot how so my ah, she's 23 years old he's 28 my boyfriend's dick was a little on the smaller side. The first times we've had sex I've never complained. He worked with it. Well, it's been about two months now and it's gotten noticeably longer. <unk>ve seen people say it's not possible to grow your dick. He said he has been exercising the muscle or some shit like that. There's a specific method that he has been using. It seems like it's working but I just feel like this goes it gets everything I've read about dicks size lo lol as anyone ever done this or seen it happen. Edit l ol ripped to my messages. I don't think it makes sense asking me how we did how we did it when I'm on red it asking you guys how it's possible. Yeah, this is another situation where he should lean into her belief that his dick is crowned like.
[35:17] Mike: I mean there is I do have a potential explanation here this morning I heard ads for not ads but a news piece because you you know this like there's at least 1 maybe 2 new drugs for obesity that have been approved or are being marketed now.
[35:19] Keith: No god.
[35:32] Keith: Yes, yes.
[35:36] Mike: Ah, would govi I think and then is it would go be the name I Actually I don't want to say it because I'm not sure. Yeah, it sounds right? exactly there're they're diabetes drugs but they and and then they mentioned that on the news report they mentioned casually.
[35:38] Keith: I don't know one of them. 1 of them is the same drug but they've just changed the name for some reason but in any case, yeah, there's more of these ozempi like drugs coming onto the market.
[35:55] Mike: And number that I sort of you know, but where we live in the San Francisco bay area like you don't see this as much that ah 40% of americans are obese which is unbelievable in any event. Yeah I mean that's just yeah I mean I and I don't want to bum out the people that were are listening to this podcast but my goodness like just ah.
[35:59] Keith: Of. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[36:15] Mike: Look up like intermittent fasting folks like just just don't eat every other day and and you'll lose a lot of weight and you can do it in any event if you lose or or you less, but but not eating so simple. Um, but ah.
[36:20] Keith: So eat less. It's a good tip.
[36:30] Mike: Losing weight actually is I mean I've noticed and maybe you've noticed this too that when I lose weight let's say I lose £20 it definitely looks bigger i' I noticed like you'll like I'll I notice it more like masturbating like let's say I'm standing up somewhere where there's some way I can see myself like if it's in a bathroom with's a mirror a shower some like that.
[36:48] Keith: Yeah.
[36:50] Mike: I'll definitely notice like oh look that looks really big and it's just because you've removed this kind of fat pad like men collect fat around their abdomen and so that could explain I don't I don't know about his special penis exercises. But if he's doing exercises broadly.
[36:57] Keith: Um, yeah.
[37:07] Mike: I Actually think this is completely possible like I think you could gain an inch or two I think so oh of of sorry of a parent let me sorry let me of a parent length if so look we we both know and our listeners probably know that the way you're supposed to measure is to push that tape measure.
[37:09] Keith: In inch or 2 Oh come on.
[37:27] Mike: On the top of your cock against your pubic bone. Ah, okay, so if you do that you're going to be measuring the full length but thing is that what you see when you're erect just standing or lying or whatever is going to be occluded by the fat and I think the appearance maybe maybe an inch. It looks a lot bigger I Have to say I agree that it looks bigger if I lose weight.
[37:27] Keith: Yes.
[37:37] Keith: Okay, still pipe.
[37:45] Keith: I can't Okay I've always been quite skinny So I don't have the firsthand experience. Ah, but okay, maybe.
[37:52] Mike: Um, okay.
[37:56] Mike: Well I'm I'm not like I've never been really overweight so I can only imagine I mean definitely like you. Okay, this isn't erect penises but you've had the experience of being in the men's locker room at the gym and seeing a guy who's overweight and they can appear to have a zero inch penis yeah
[38:11] Keith: Yeah, it looks really sad. Yeah no I hear you on this fat pad thing I I hear you but you initially said it could grow 1 to 2 edgeches and then you walked it back to an apparent 1 to 2 itches which is another which is another way of saying like nowhere close to 1 to 2 edgeches. But.
[38:16] Mike: So then that yeah.
[38:25] Mike: That's what I meant That's what I meant it? No no, no, it's a look it. It looks bigger because if you were using a tape measure. You wouldn't have to jam it into the fat pad the same way I mean how like okay if you think about the fat pad over your.
[38:29] Keith: Okay.
[38:34] Keith: Yeah, okay.
[38:42] Mike: Pubic bone like how thick is it like I think mine is one one inch seems plausible. It's not you know a tenth of an inch. It's much thicker than that.
[38:49] Keith: I Think mine's pretty I think mine's yeah I don't have much fat there for me Just let me just poke around down there for a second here.
[38:56] Mike: Okay, well I think it's normal for guys to have a reasonable amount of fat there. This is great I think it's I actually think mine might be two inches it's it's material and I'm not particularly overweight right now. Yeah, so yeah.
[39:07] Keith: I Don't think so man. No, you're not no, you're in good shape.
[39:16] Mike: I'm not I'm not standing up I'm sitting down so that's going to collect a little bit of skin there I could stand up and do it I It would definitely get less if I stood up but I I mean I can't do like a scientific study of this I'm not sure how I would but I definitely have and it's specific to losing weight I've looked in the mirror before I'm been like damn like that's.
[39:20] Keith: Um, yeah.
[39:33] Keith: Um, I would be a nice nice experience. Okay, somebody speculates here. They say most of our bonus ah bones are 90 to 95% you're witnessing a 100% boner like he's relaxed around you now and has achieved maximum erection or something.
[39:34] Mike: It's noticeably bigger seeming. It is.
[39:51] Keith: And don't think that? Yeah, ah yeah I mean I definitely have some erections that are harder than others but I don't think that there's that much variance and length.
[39:54] Mike: I've done some measurement around this during the masturbation process and it doesn't I don't think it gets any longer like significantly longer.
[40:05] Mike: Um, yeah I mean and it kind of makes sense because you can you can actually take your your flaccid penis and and pull on it right? You can pull it out to its full length. Basically it's a little uncomfortable which you can. You can't do that.
[40:11] Keith: Just turgidity. Ah ah I can't I don't think I can do that I don't think I can do that? No I don't think so.
[40:23] Mike: I mean it makes sense that you would be able to right I mean it's not yeah, don't don't pull your pants down for the love of God this one I'm pretty sure of you. Okay.
[40:25] Keith: It does now that you mention it but it seems like it back down Mike I'm going back out of don't worry I'm not going to pan the camera here. No I don't think I can I don't think I can there's something I can feel this.
[40:41] Mike: Ah, you could do it for science. Do some measuring.
[40:42] Keith: And stretches but the but the like interior flesh can't be pulled out needs all right.
[40:47] Mike: I Think it can because it's just a ah tube containing blood and so you're just you're just manually extending it instead of ah I mean.
[40:52] Keith: Um, yeah, you're enough. Yeah, inflating the flesh.
[41:00] Mike: Right? And I mean you know that they are like 1 of the treatments for kind of elderly people with um ed is these tubes they stick in their penises that they can then inflate right.
[41:11] Keith: Um, ah ah yeah I've I've heard right right? right? Ran right.
[41:15] Mike: I mean but but whatever like your body's just a mechanical device. So of course you can pull it out like there's no, there's no, it's not like you. It's not like the spirit of God inhabits your penis and makes it bigger. It's not adding to the amount of ligament and tendon in there. Whatever it is anyway.
[41:23] Keith: Right? Yeah, all right I don't think that guy's penis is getting materially longer. But maybe he lost a hundred pounds all right. This person says boyfriend touches me in my sleep. New boyfriend of a couple months touched me in my sleep and I enjoyed it first while we were napping then in the morning and then again while napping I would quote fall asleep first that is to say pretending to fall asleep while in a spooning position I could feel him get hard just from spooning and that turns me on after not moving for a bit we would. He would start touching my back and then workers worry down to where my butt and legs connect then move his hand into my shorts and start rubbing my clit and finger me lightly all while I'm pretending to sleep. Okay isn't this rape.
[42:10] Mike: I mean I don't know because I don't know if there's like I mean no, it's not no. It's not.
[42:14] Keith: We know that she is pretending to be asleep. We know she has not given consent. In fact, she's sort of aroused by that. That's why she's pretending. This is definitely rape like you can imagine and that somebody else writing like while I'm sleeping my boyfriend fondles me.
[42:24] Mike: No.
[42:33] Keith: And I'm afraid to say anything So I pretend I'm asleep would you? Okay, well yes, but some people would say both those things most people would say the latter is definitely rape and I think by extension the former. The former must also definitely be rape.
[42:34] Mike: Yeah I would say that wasn't I would say that wasn't rape either the person complaining about it. It's It's not.
[42:47] Mike: I I think it's complicated because if you I'm not sure I'm not a lawyer I think that I think that once you're in a relationship with someone. There's some notion that like the default is consent. However, you can withdraw consent.
[42:51] Keith: In both cases. The man is assuming the woman is liking it or is at least tolerating.
[43:05] Mike: Now she's asleep which makes it kind of like a ah ah ah, gray area. But if she woke up and withdrew consent and and then also he didn't penetrate her which I think does matter.
[43:14] Keith: I Didn't mean to I didn't mean to put you onto the spot here. Yeah I generally agree I'm I'm being a little bit ah like pedantic I guess but I mean I Just think that just because she happens to want it. He doesn't know that.
[43:18] Mike: I Don't care.
[43:31] Keith: And if it is the case that in some cases this can be rape then it must be the case like not knowing must mean that it's rape. Ah, you're you're arguing. It's not rape in the first place. So.
[43:40] Mike: But she I mean no no, it doesn't it doesn't because the because it matters that they're in like look the whole topic of sort of Ah, what's the term. It's not acquaintance Rape. It's some. I Guess relationship rape is like complicated because of this because there's all kinds of things that happen in. Yeah,, there's all kinds of implied consent and stuff that happens in relationships and so um I So I don't I I don't think like as a legal matter this would be considered rape.
[43:59] Keith: Um, once consent is given it's imply until it's explicitly withdrawn right.
[44:16] Keith: Could it be considered rape if she didn't want it as a legal matter. Let's say it's on video. Yeah, ah, no yeah I guess she hasn't in either case, told them no.
[44:22] Mike: Um, if she if she told him don't do that.
[44:28] Mike: Yeah, and it would be complicated because I think it would be a valid I mean look Ultimately, these things are just like good to a jury right? like the question would matter it would matter whether like because you'd ask the question will wait. He has this thing he likes to do that. You don't want him to do. Why didn't you break up with him like you know? yeah.
[44:44] Keith: Um, right.
[44:47] Mike: It's yeah and you could say oh well she has boundaries and it's like yeah of course she should be able to have boundaries but but her her behaviors have to make sense to a reasonable person like a if a reasonable person in the guy's situation was able you know concluded like hey she's okay with this. Well then it's not rape. You know.
[45:03] Keith: Right? Yeah, okay, that was really the only thing I wanted to talk about on this topic I mean I can read the rest of it then when he stops after another 10 minutes I'll pretend to wake up and I'll start doing it again.
[45:06] Mike: And tricky.
[45:17] Keith: I've never brought up how I've always had the kink of wanting to be touched in my sleep. Always just wish he would just start doing it So when he did without being asked really turned me on and got me wet. Sometimes I wish you would have sex with me while I slept is this normal or weird should I tell him I know he's touching me and enjoy it. But she mean to have sex while she's she's not sleeping in any of these situations. Yes, like I I get what she wants here is she just not making any sense.
[45:35] Mike: Um, she wants to be Ah, she wants to feel vulnerable to him.
[45:43] Mike: Um, makes sense I mean she wants she wants to be vulnerable and available to him. It turns her on that he is thinking about her even when she's not like actively doing anything. She's thinking to herself. Oh he's he's obsessed with me and she likes that it. It works for.
[46:00] Keith: Yeah, but yeah, whatever I don't need to she keep saying that like she wants him to have sex with me while I'm asleep but she's not asleep the thing that she likes is feeling attractive while she's conscious.
[46:07] Mike: Wait you. No I understand.
[46:19] Keith: So she's she's not just.
[46:19] Mike: That's true. That's true I mean it wouldn't would like you can you? Ah, if you had a you're going to say no because you're going to say oh I want to sleep and I value my sleep and I have important things to do the next morning but like but wouldn't you I mean wouldn't you find it compelling if a woman was so.
[46:27] Keith: Give me a chance here. But I no better what you say I probably can say that.
[46:36] Mike: Excited by you that she wanted to like fondle your cock while you're lying there or whatever that she just couldn't keep her hands off of you.
[46:37] Keith: Yeah, yeah I think I mean a super a super popular porn trope is the girl starts blowing the guy while he's sleeping now as discussed in the past I think that's basically impossible like if somebody starts pulling down my underwear. But.
[46:47] Mike: Yes.
[46:54] Keith: I'm a very light sleeper. So I'm sure I would wake up but hypothetically yeah, that would be kind of cool.
[46:58] Mike: Um, even if you needed a p.
[47:01] Keith: You know it's annoying when you have an erection and you want to pee. It's It's just a little bit hard to pee when you're when you're fully erected.
[47:07] Mike: Oh.
[47:14] Mike: I remember in middle school we where I was at a camping trip and are discussing this with ah another boy his name was Stephen and ah and Stephen thought he could not be with an erection I knew that I could I don't think we ever settled it.
[47:18] Keith: Ah.
[47:22] Keith: I statement.
[47:31] Keith: Yeah, yeah, the.
[47:32] Mike: Just said like I I can do it. You should try and he was certain he could not I think the answer is you can I think men generally can. It's just like a little less fun like it feels like the PS to go around a corner or something.
[47:43] Keith: I'm trying to think like let's say yeah, it's a little bit hard to get like the flow going or something but but once yeah, it works. Ah yeah.
[47:53] Mike: Um, yeah, and you will tend to lose your erection while being.
[47:58] Keith: I was just having the thought like let's say you and I had this debate right now I was like look man I can pee when I have an erection and you're like no, you can't and then you said you know here's $10000 for you to prove it I'm not sure. Yeah I would have to like get an erection around you and then.
[48:15] Mike: And I don't want to do that experiment but the.
[48:17] Keith: Yeah I don't want to do it either I'm just saying I think it could be tricky but it would probably be easier when you're a teen and erections come come and go more easily. Well come anyway.
[48:27] Mike: Yeah I hear you yeah might my think my thought is something like I mean at at core an erection is muscles I'm not sure if the word muscles right? But it's but blood vessels tensing up to keep blood in the penis and maybe that also tends to constrict. The urethra I Know there's like a valve to prevent semen from going back into the Bladder. So It might relate to that as Well. I'm not actually sure what the physiological mechanism is that makes it makes it more difficult. It is definitely more difficult and it feels like there's some something you navigate and I would say.
[48:48] Keith: Um.
[49:03] Mike: Even feels like you're kind of pushing past something that you maybe shouldn't like it's like oh I'm defeating some safety valve in my body when I pee with an erection. No no.
[49:11] Keith: Do you think women have a similar thing and does that mean that the ones that are squirting are really trying extra hard because it's kind of nice that men don't accidentally pee during various sex acts like you never hear about men squirting.
[49:30] Mike: That's true. No I mean I think there's more structure to the man's urinary tract because of the penis and the prostate and everything well a question that I think is more interesting with regard to women's squirting since I know they're peeing and I know in porn and in cam girls they are.
[49:31] Keith: Ah, okay, okay, okay.
[49:45] Mike: You can see that they're just like trying to meter out their p to make it look like they're squirting I Always wonder whether they have to like make sure they've like done an enema beforehand because oftentimes it's let's see. Yeah you can't but you might poop right? like.
[50:00] Keith: If you're like really bearing down to try to pee. Yeah.
[50:05] Mike: Yeah, that's right if if you were sitting down on the toilet and you really had to like pee and you had to like kind of meter it out properly. You could imagine like being a little unsure of what was going to come out the other hole too. Yeah and I think that's particularly pronounced for women.
[50:12] Keith: Yeah, yeah I think most people don't like engaging in sex when there's any chance of pooping I don't yeah I'm I'm less likely to initiate if.
[50:25] Mike: And yeah I would be unusual, be unusual. So ah, an unusual and curious form of lubricant for anal.
[50:31] Keith: I'm having any if I'm having any kind of gi distress I'm less less likely to initiate all right. This person says this is probably our last topic today divorced at age 50 and found myself not sexually attracted to women my own age.
[50:38] Mike: Um, that makes sense.
[50:47] Keith: 20 year marriage was sexless beyond having our 3 children plus maybe twice a year I knew very little about sex or intiancy twice a year is an odd number I would expect it to be 0 I wonder what happened on those two days a year anyway yeah I guess just one of their birthdays.
[50:50] Mike: Um, wow.
[50:56] Mike: Birthday and anniversary maybe like some some specific that must have been kind of enraging for one part of your there for whoever wanted more. It must have been enraging to have it not I think I think in a lot of ways zero would be easier.
[51:07] Keith: Ah, yeah, you yeah because you know they can you know they just won't all right? even though my wife never had sex with me I think the word he meant to say is rarely I still felt to the compulsion. So I masturbated to porn.
[51:15] Mike: A fight.
[51:25] Keith: In fact, I've had a life of masturbating to porn it merely became my way to scratch the itch after my divorce I made a conscious choice to only see company from women over 40 younger women while very attractive. Don't have any lasting appeal mean man beyond sexual I a 53 year old man met June a 44 year old female right? after my divorce three years ago she was a breath of fresh air june loved and still loves me with every ounce of her being. She was physically attracted to me in a way that I've never experienced her lust for me is endless at first it was great even though I had such a tough time with it. I loved her voracious appetite but I have to admit I wasn't fully turned on I had such a different cold time finishing and maintaining. Um, better at it three years later but it's still very difficult. Oh man, hope she never reads this I'm still not turned on by her I love and adore everything else about June any man would be beyond thankful for her except for him she knows about my problem and it hurts her but she has been so patient. What do you think he told her sorry.
[52:18] Mike: Well she knows that he has trouble finishing and women I think in general would be attuned to that. So if it you know if it happens. Yeah if it happens frequently. It's a problem right.
[52:22] Keith: Yeah.
[52:29] Keith: Yeah, he goes on. She says she wants to heal my porn addiction I'm not sure it can be healed I've had decades to become wired this way. It's important to say I'm fully aware of my porn addiction I've successfully quit for long periods and relapsed and quit again. However, it doesn't change what turns me on yes I can quit no I cannot make myself turned on by june. Very frustrating now I've come to the point that 2 things really bother me one sex with tuna is not satisfying at all in any way. 2 june is hurt by my lack of passion and sexual energy for her hurting her hurts me having said that I'm almost done I don't think I could be sexually attracted to women near my age. Was accustomed to a life without sex and wasn't really expecting this the porn I watched almost never portrayed 40 to 50 year old women except maybe the subjectively hottest women of that age I'm not even sure a real woman could do that to could do the trick at all I've ruined myself. My only conclusion is that I need to prepare for a life of abstinence I need to break up with June which is a problem.
[53:11] Mike: Is.
[53:23] Keith: And to its own because we live together. There's more to that story but blah blah blah however, apart from my sex problem I do like the idea of being without a partner the idea of being alone is positive to me I'm an introvert very comfortable with myself should I break up with June or am I throwing my life away. Ah because I have an ideal woman and life partner I don't know what he should do. But. Ah, what I mean most men are attracted to young women and so I guess there's degrees here.
[53:51] Mike: Yeah I mean it's not that surprising that he early on he said that he'd he found younger women annoying or something he had some reason why he didn't want to go that direction. He could just be unable to attract one that seems.
[54:08] Keith: Oh you're wondering why he's saying his 2 choices are June or nothing. Yeah.
[54:09] Mike: Likely.
[54:14] Mike: Right? It's a little confusing there I mean it's ah he seems like a natural candidate for like a sugaring website to be honest with you. Um, this is the kind of but maybe maybe that wouldn't.
[54:22] Keith: Um, yeah.
[54:29] Mike: The kind of man that those things sort of cater to um and I also don't really know what? well I'm guessing that it's just lack of attractiveness that makes it so that he has trouble getting excited with this woman.
[54:42] Keith: Um, I mean one of the things 1 of the directions I thought this conversation could go is you know people in their twenty s are not attracted to women in their fifty s and then what happens we know we've we've seen studies where they ask men.
[54:52] Mike: M.
[55:01] Keith: Who are the most attractive women and they basically always say women between the ages of 20 and 23 but yeah yeah, okay cupidd it's I think so ok Cupid did this and I think.
[55:06] Mike: Is that right? It's not 15 and 18 or something.
[55:19] Keith: Ah, they looked at which profiles got the most attention from people of all age and for women it's a sliding scale that slowly goes up over time. So as women age the men they find most attractive also age.
[55:25] Mike: Sure.
[55:34] Mike: Okay, that makes perfect sense like biologically which yeah I mean all these things wind up making sense biologically but okay, go on.
[55:36] Keith: But as men age the women they find most attractive don't age. But.
[55:45] Keith: Okay, now for a man though many men as they age become less able to attract younger women and so to some extent are just people are going to like this but are settling right? like that they they take what they can get and. I'm guessing some people are more able to tolerate this than others like what's going on.
[56:09] Mike: Well I mean there are a couple things one is that the well I separate it a little from the from this guy but it it relates to the thing he said I think there are probably generational gaps that make it difficult to be attracted to like somebody 20 years younger than you. Ah, people probably always say this but I'll say it anyway, it's I feel like that. Yeah, it's like a broken record. Ah generationally. But ah, right now I think that generation gap is kind of large. Ah, maybe it's always large maybe in the 1970 s people that were from the 1950 s would say the people you know now are so different than we were and that's actually probably true. But I think sometimes it's narrower I would guess it's kind of a wave that sometimes it's narrower and I think right now it's much larger because you have a generation of people that just.
[56:50] Keith: Yeah.
[57:00] Keith: Right.
[57:00] Mike: Are on their phone all the time and are so heavily influenced by social media and this guy was born say in the late sixty s ah and so his experiences you know going outdoors and doing activities and whatever like he did he lived. He's you know most of his life happened before I guess before the internet really was popular. So.
[57:10] Keith: Yeah.
[57:16] Keith: Um, yeah.
[57:19] Mike: That's a pretty big generation gap and so I I could imagine him just saying look. We just have no I have nothing in common with these people and so his choices are kind of limited because of that settling That's probably that's probably right.
[57:28] Keith: I Don't think they're limited because of that I think they're limited I think they're limited because those women would not be sexually interested in him.
[57:38] Mike: Um, well. Okay, yeah I mean there's that too I think that's it's interesting between the it really depends on the particulars of the guy to to know that one. Um I mean we see a fair number of questions from. Guys who are dating someone 20 years younger than them and it's kind of culturally somewhat Common. It's going. Um I think it's somewhat obvious that it'll be a guy that has more going for him if he's older and she's younger. But so I don't know in this case but I think even if it was a guy who could attract women that were that young I could see him.
[58:00] Keith: Yeah.
[58:12] Mike: Like you could see a guy saying this is this generation Gap is just too large. It's it's it's too annoying. Basically um yeah I mean there are other there are other things I mean there's a this is probably a common one too. But you I read Apparently there is.
[58:16] Keith: Yeah.
[58:29] Mike: Less dispersion in kind of belief systems among 20 to 20 to 30 year olds right now than what was in the past meaning there's and this I'm sure as to do with social media so might be difficult to find a woman that's whose kind of thoughts and beliefs align with yours certainly going to be difficult to find someone who's like read a book. You know.
[58:41] Keith: Okay, yeah, okay look. There's obvious issues with large H Gap relationships in terms of compatibility outside of the bedroom. But what I'm interested in here is as men age. Do they.
[58:50] Mike: Um, yeah.
[59:00] Keith: Actually start becoming more attracted to older women is there something biologically that's happening there or is it just settling.
[59:06] Mike: Okay I can answer this I think the answer is no but the answer is no but I think you become more aware that all women are just people and have a lot of flaws and so the kind of.
[59:13] Keith: Yikes.
[59:25] Mike: Angel that you imagined when you were 22 you know the the sort of you know the canonical thing is like the woman who doesn't poop. You know oh women don't poop that's gone and so then you so you start saying well? Okay, yeah, they're more attractive but like they're not that different.
[59:26] Keith: Um, yeah.
[59:30] Keith: Right? right.
[59:42] Mike: You know you? so you start to like sort of be able to parse it a little bit that way. So yeah I mean yeah, you don't You're more realistic about right? Yeah, well you realize that women are mostly the same as men and so it's not. It's this is just like another human and it's not.
[59:42] Keith: Okay, you become more mature in your evaluation criteria. It's not just you know who has a perkius hits. It's you know.
[01:00:02] Mike: Magical in the way that it was at a younger age and say you might not care as much but that being said I think look there is still an attractiveness delta and I think that I mean look you can see it in all kinds of areas you see it where guys will reliably pick the younger woman.
[01:00:18] Keith: Yeah, yeah, okay yeah I guess that corroborates my experience like I find myself more attracted to to older women but I'm not sure if it's now I've.
[01:00:20] Mike: If given a free choice. So.
[01:00:32] Mike: You do you mean? younger.
[01:00:37] Keith: I have like a constant amount of attraction to young young women. That's always been the same but I that's a better way of saying it I suppose and meaner.
[01:00:39] Mike: Oh you find that older women are less unattractive. Yeah I mean in youth. Do you think the reason why is because you've become more aware of the like everybody has flaws.
[01:00:51] Keith: I mean I don't think I would have articulated it that way but now that you have that that feels about right? there's it's something like yeah, there's other benefits of dating people who are more or who are more compelling for reasons other than like they're exclusively. You know they're. Their physical looks and.
[01:01:12] Mike: Um, but even physical looks I mean like this is obviously like a male audience or male males I'm talking about but like in the locker room after the swimming class I do several days a week in the early mornings. You know there. There are men of different ages. None of them are like in their twenty s but they're.
[01:01:28] Keith: Ah.
[01:01:30] Mike: Men in their 30 s for sure and they're men in their like 60 s and in there are definitely cases where the guys in their sixty s are more physically fit than the guys in their thirty s and okay, the guy in their 30 his thirty s like has tighter skin. But.
[01:01:31] Keith: Um, yeah.
[01:01:36] Keith: For sure. Yeah.
[01:01:47] Mike: I Don't it gets kind of complicated now for women I think it's less that men men I think age better in that regard or it's easier for men. But I think there can be something similar.
[01:01:54] Keith: Um I don't know if they better it. There's something biologically that our bodies the male body stops being as attracted to things that are less fertile and it sucks and it's not like you know quote Unquote fair. But. Think that's just sort of how the biology works whereas whereas a 65 year old man can still reproduce ably.
[01:02:14] Mike: Um, sure.
[01:02:19] Mike: That's true, but like at some point you're as a guy you're not interested in impregnating someone that likes that like is not yeah.
[01:02:22] Keith: Yeah, but you can't turn off yeah intellectually, but you can't turn off the like biological attraction function.
[01:02:30] Mike: It gets toned down a little bit. But yeah, it's not turned off. That's right, That's right, you still you still? Yeah I mean you still are like oh look at her. That's right, That's right? yes.
[01:02:39] Keith: Like like the reason the orgasm is occurring is too impregnate like that's sort of the base level thing that's going on I don't know if people knew that all right, that'll do it for this episode of your mileage may very you could send does feedback or questions to ymmvpod at Gmail.com that's why mmv poditch youmail.com we pay $10 for feedback. So just let us know how you'd like to be paid and if you ask us a question. Let us know if you don't want us to use it on the show. Thanks for your time. Thanks for listening and we'll catch you next week on your mileage may vary.

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Episode 143: Lube Lessons, Older Meets Younger, Condom Presumption, Male Eruptions

Episode Transcript