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Episode 69: Oral Only Relationships, Seeking ENM, Chad Body Count, Pubic Requests, Hitachi Travel

Team YMMV | 6-2-2022 | 1:04:26

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Keith wants to see how easy it is to find an Ethically Non-Monogamous second partner. He wants to follow all the rules and be completely up front in what he's seeking, and he wants to see how many women will respond positively o such a message. So, he has a set of women who have "liked" him on dating apps, and he's going to send them an honest message. How many will respond positively?

Separately, we're here to help women discern how they pick the men they do. Honestly, the incels have a point here, in that women like to hide from the truth that not many men are that attractive, and most women purse a small set of guys.

A man has the unpleasant habit of anally penetrating himself in his leisure time, and he's (rightfully) reluctant to reveal that to his female partner. A woman is confused by a man's desire for her to be totally bare "down there," and another woman is concerned about air travel with her rather large vibrator.

And, can a relationship survive on oral sex alone? Answer: Yes, provided the partners are in their teens!

We get a lot of our questions from Reddit, so for our listeners' enjoyment, here are links to some of the questions we discussed this week:

https://ymmv.me/69/dislike-sex

https://ymmv.me/69/prostate-surprise

https://ymmv.me/69/anal-virginity

https://ymmv.me/69/outer-labia

https://ymmv.me/69/male-lingerie

https://ymmv.me/69/oral-only

https://ymmv.me/69/pubic-requests

https://ymmv.me/69/hitachi-travel

Episode Transcript

Transcript automatically generated by a robot. Apologies for any inaccuracies.

  • [00:00] Keith: Hello and welcome to your mileage may vary. We talk about sex and relationships in a way that is often controversial but usually in good faith. We think you'll enjoy our combination of candor and deadpan humor on the topic list today are conversations about having sex with someone you hate heterosexual anal and prostate play. Various unexpected post-sex pains and more and Keith my cohost is Mike welcome Mike so on our last episode I promised to collate a list of my finest online dating openers and I also promised to run an experiment announcing by.
  • [00:21] Mike: Thanks Keith.
  • [01:11] Keith: Ethical non-monogamy to unknowing online dating matches I've done neither but I'm noting it here so that I'm held to it and will have that ready for next week
  • [01:07] Mike: Yeah, does ah does having sex with someone you hate count masturbating if you're like depressed.
  • [01:42] Keith: Now that is not the topic of that is not the the crux of our upcoming topic. But yeah I mean we were. We had a big our listeners. So know this but we had a big grammatical discussion before we started recording here hands.
  • [01:31] Mike: All right.
  • [02:22] Keith: Yeah, it yeah does is masturbating having sex with yourself is that grammatically correct is it can't is having sex with yourself just basically another way of saying masturbating.
  • [02:13] Mike: I Think so I think so and I think that people who hate themselves or if you're depressed or whatever which doesn't have to mean you hate yourself. But I think people do actually masturbate less in that condition and so yeah, like I think it's actually true that people. Yeah, they don't want to have sex with themselves.
  • [03:01] Keith: Who.
  • [03:12] Keith: Um, yeah.
  • [02:52] Mike: Although it's probably more about not wanting to experience pleasure or like not being able to experience pleasure but that you know if if you're fucking someone you hate. Although you could we should get. We should wait till we get to the topic. So yeah.
  • [03:33] Keith: Yeah I mean I should have responded your quip there on that topic. But the topic's too old now. So I won't get any of that sweet Reddit karma um I wanted to bring up something weird that happened to me this week this happened ah a few days ago this girl that I dated I don't know. Even though if dated is the right word. We never had sex. Ah but I met her on an app and we hung out I don't know None or None times a number of times. But. Never felt like making a move would have availed positive results and so I never did and we ended up drifting apart. Ah how so.
  • [04:49] Mike: That's interesting I mean okay, that's interesting. Oh it's interesting because it's I mean was she attractive. Yeah I mean that probably never happens to her.
  • [05:21] Keith: She was attractive and she was not she wasn't particularly interesting to me beyond that she was young so like intellectually it was sort of interesting to chat with someone like her and understand her worldview a bit. But there wasn't any long-term relationship potential there and so ah, it was during a time when I was dating a lot. It was during a time when I was dating a lot and so you know she was just you know one in a crowd. But anyway she messaged me a few days ago. She said hi there. It's let's call her Jane.
  • [05:48] Mike: This is sounding very feminine. Okay.
  • [06:39] Keith: Hi there. It's Jane remember me and I responded hi Jane yes, of course hello and she said what have you been up to ah now well let me just read the entirety of the exchange because it only goes on for a couple more message I said all kinds of things getting ready to head to Europe for the summer she said.
  • [06:32] Mike: M.
  • [07:18] Keith: You're the None person to tell me they're going to Europe for the summer ha ha I'll be taking my first trip out there in November France and italy and I responded that's great exclamation point. What was her? What do you think her intent was in her reaching out.
  • [07:30] Mike: Ah, to because yeah because ah yeah, be she's not I mean this is I think that like the listeners at home can decipher this pretty well or should be able to like if you if you listen to our show and you're sort of.
  • [07:55] Keith: That was the end of the conversation. She didn't respond to mine. That's great.
  • [08:07] Mike: Getting into the vibe of being able to figure out these inner personal relationships. You should be able to figure it out I mean she she wanted to rekindle the romance and have sex with you a bunch of times and she is intrigued. She's intrigued by the fact that you didn't try to have sex with her which probably if she's attractive happens. Every single time she goes on a date with anybody so that shows she remembers you you stand out in that way and then as soon as you said you were going to Europe she lost all interest because now you're unavailable and then she said she was going to Europe and new people going to Europe because she wanted to very slightly kind of down level. Yeah.
  • [09:07] Keith: Yes, yes.
  • [09:40] Keith: It's like a defense. Yeah, okay.
  • [09:23] Mike: She's basically like oh well, you know you're not that great because she wants you know that's yeah she do. Yeah she did right? She didn't have to send that but she she wanted to yeah, kind of push you down a little bit.
  • [09:58] Keith: Yeah I don't have any interest in rekindling with this person and so I regret saying getting ready to head for Europe for the summer it was too much of a shutdown I should have I was trying to signal that. I was very well. Um, but I overachieved in that sense and I would have liked to have seen her suffer the indignity of actually proposing something and then me saying like no sorry I have a girlfriend now and I'm going to Europe and you suck. Without having to actually say that and I guess in some ways. Yeah directionally I guess I actually did that.
  • [10:55] Mike: Um, I mean the direction I Actually well no the direction I thought this was going to go and I'm a little disappointed is I thought it would go you telling her you're in an E N M relationship and trying to yeah just have sex with her.
  • [11:45] Keith: Well I would have enjoyed running that experiment and I sort of blew it with with this I'm not sure I don't know. Yeah I'm not sure if she if she was quote unquote down if I would be in any circumstance. But.
  • [11:34] Mike: Yeah.
  • [11:58] Mike: Okay, yeah I mean she probably wouldn't be because if she if it was just a straight booty call The fact that you're leaving soon wouldn't necessarily matter right? I mean you're still here now. It's ah it's pretty obvious she wanted. She's.
  • [12:24] Keith: It would have been a good chance to run the experiment.
  • [12:47] Keith: That's true. Yeah.
  • [12:35] Mike: As are almost all women on these things looking for some sort of like an ongoing relationship. So yeah.
  • [13:02] Keith: Yeah, all right? Youre read. It's the same as mine on this. Let's move on. Ah I was gonna mention the construction going on next door to my apartment I just spoke to one of the people out there. They said it's gonna be going on for six months which is sort of an outrageous imposition by my neighbors in my opinion but they're not making any noise right now. So it doesn't matter. Um all right? Let's get into the topics unless do you have any other pattern before I start diving into some of these all right? um.
  • [13:44] Mike: No, let's do it.
  • [14:19] Keith: And liked this one and I'm curious to see where our conversation goes with it. Ah, this person says I a 24 year old female had sex with someone I dislike and it was the best I ever had should I continue or is that a bad idea we've met through mutual friends and our dislike is mutual absolutely cannot stand him and he can't stand me. However, I was always physically attracted to him. She puts a parentheses against my will ah that she did not consent to be physically attracted to him last week we both agreed to fuck so we had a brief conversation and then hooked up. It was by far the best sex I've ever had just pure passion. He wanted to eat me out none thing. And I was a bit reluctant since I'd never come from that also I wanted to give him headfirst boy was I wrong. Maybe it was the combination of knowing that it was him eating me out or his skills but he or his skills but he managed to make me come after a few minutes I was shocked and a little annoyed that set the scene and it just got better from there. Not only did I have a body shaking orgasm for the none time he gave me multiple It was nothing like I've ever experienced before he was hot confident and attentive and his dirty talk absolutely ruined me I'm still masturbating to the memories and it's been a week I do want to have sex again. But I'm starting to think it's a bad idea I seriously do not like him on a personal level at all. So not sure if it's wise to continue with this and transmission.
  • [16:36] Mike: Yeah I mean she ah this is this is the fact pattern This is basically the fact pattern that like drives in sell men insane because what's going on here is this guy's really attractive. He's like top. Whatever percent attractive and yeah and so and and I mean.
  • [17:26] Keith: Seems probable.
  • [17:15] Mike: There can be a number of reasons she doesn't like him the most obvious would be some sort of obvious like some one of the standard boring kind of political divides that you see in America so like he is pro-gun or something and she's not and whatever. There's some. There's some like religious slash political divide that makes it so it's impossible for to like him but it doesn't matter.
  • [18:05] Keith: Yeah I agree that's likely why she's dismissed him.
  • [17:54] Mike: Yeah, it doesn't matter because she's indexed low on that because he's so attractive and then and this makes sense to me like actually having sex with him is better and he's he's good at it and the reason he's good at it partly is because he's had like none partners which doesn't always mean that I know that there's stories of women who say oh this guy just you know. He knows any woman will sleep with him and so he's no good at it. But like you know if you do something a lot with a lot of different partners. You're going to in most cases or in many cases achieve some skills there and so yeah I mean the the main the main point I would make is like look you're yeah you just had sex with a guy that's had like None partners.
  • [19:22] Keith: Yeah, it's like the most anti-feminist possible behavior.
  • [19:04] Mike: And so.
  • [19:14] Mike: Yeah, but I mean and it shows something also in that like her brain basically rewarded her for that behavior which goes to like the whole evolutionary hypothesis that women you know want to live with share their life with one man but get impregnated by the other man. So This is the guy that's supposed to impregnate you and then you're supposed to Cuckold. He's cuckolding the other guy I mean that's that would be like the kind of surface level interpretation that I would have there. Yeah, it's no different than a man wanting to yeah, it's no different than like if I Watch. Ah.
  • [20:28] Keith: Yeah, it's hard to just disagree with any of that.
  • [20:23] Mike: Any of a variety of sporting events that have cheerleaders and I think to myself. Oh I'd like to impregnate all of the cheerleaders That's like a normal male and it's like it's not adaptive or like good for modern society. But like yeah I'd like to and I'm sure I would have very good orgasms while doing that right? because my brain would.
  • [21:09] Keith: Right? right? How do you think this right? Yeah, Okay, how do you think this chad pivoted the conversation toward. Ah we should hook up. She says last week. We both agreed to fuck.
  • [20:57] Mike: Reward me. They're like oh look at her breasts.
  • [21:47] Keith: So we had a brief conversation and then hooked up alcohol in a party or something.
  • [21:30] Mike: Um, I mean I think that he look if you maybe but I mean I think that if you're somebody who has this level of success with women. He's probably just extremely confident about that interaction I mean that's yeah.
  • [22:19] Keith: Yeah.
  • [22:03] Mike: Yeah I mean if you if you are a person that gets turned down say yeah if you're if you're getting turned down 99% of the time. Sure they're guys that are natural salesmen and just don't care and and that works by the way if as a guy if you're willing to just approach woman after woman after woman you will approach a woman who says yes because there's some percentage of women who will and it's not It's not point none 1% like it's I'm not saying you can approach a woman and ask for sex immediately. But you can approach women and like they'll go out on a date with you like they'll you'll start the process. But for this guy like the rate is much much higher and so he just yeah, he just has like a pattern he goes into and he knows it's going to.
  • [23:19] Keith: Um, yeah.
  • [23:14] Mike: Work most of the time or maybe half the time and he doesn't really care if it doesn't because you know you're on some sort of list and he'll just go to the next person he's like I've got my prostate is full here.
  • [23:44] Keith: Right? Yeah yeah, I'm not sure if he's shotgunning out invitations or using a sniper rifle but his success rate makes it so that whatever his strategy is he doesn't have he doesn't.
  • [23:59] Mike: Yeah, there's no I mean I don't have anything I don't think there's anything wrong with the situation that happened I don't I'm not trying to like slut shame the woman here the the thing that the thing I would point out though is that she in my opinion doesn't understand what's going on. That's the thing I would say and I think with this sort of chad situation. That's often the case like the women don't.
  • [24:21] Keith: Feel Any downside risk.
  • [24:33] Keith: Sure.
  • [24:38] Mike: If they had a like a photo book of all the women. The guy had slept with they would be like oh and I think that they like women tend to hide from that information or somehow not care because they yeah people and have a natural tendency to assign to other people the same kind of desires and.
  • [25:05] Keith: Right? right.
  • [25:16] Mike: Modes of operation that they have for themselves. They'd be like oh well who would have sex with 500 different people who would do that and it's like men would do that like all basically all men would do that if they can so.
  • [25:45] Keith: Right? Yeah yeah I look the specifics of this situation. Notwithstanding I I agree with your general take here that yeah, she's choosing someone for sex that. She otherwise finds despicable and the reasons why she's choosing that person are somewhat of a mystery to her.
  • [26:10] Mike: I mean there is also the the other thing that came to my mind when you were reading it was. It reminds me a little of like the plot of a romantic comedy like when Harry Met Sally like I mean that movie famously. The characters hate each other at the beginning right? I don't know if you've seen or care about that movie. But yeah.
  • [26:55] Keith: Right? I've seen. Yep yeah Billy Crystal and Meg Ryan
  • [26:46] Mike: Hate each other at the beginning and then you know so like maybe she has some sort of yes it could go that direction too. It could be that actually like ah you know she hates him in quotes but it's like Asteriss Acaris she actually likes you know there's that possibility too. It's just more fun to say that he's a Chad. Yeah.
  • [27:32] Keith: Sure sure sure sure. Yeah I mean that's why I said the specifics of this notwithstanding like who knows what's actually going on. But yeah I agree with your general taker all right next mail here. My girlfriend wants to try and play with my ass slash prostate but she doesn't know I've been doing this for years.
  • [27:24] Mike: Um, yeah.
  • [27:47] Mike: Don't know.
  • [28:11] Keith: So occasionally doing for play by girlfriend rubs my ass and is hinted. She's into fingering me and stimulating my prostate I'm very shy about it all and I don't know how to react I'm seen by her and everyone else I believe as a masculine straight guy but to be honest I love anal play and have been enjoying it on myself since puberty I don't know how to react to her doing this with me. Scared to show the side of me that not only am I okay with a finger in my butt but I'm into having much more and have before how do I tell my girlfriend I really like it in my ass and I can take more than a finger or None no problem I don't want to come on too strong or make her or make her feel different about me at the end of the day I'm happy to I got a. Grammar is driving me crazy I'm happy I got a partner who's curious about turning me on this way. But I'm afraid to show her that I'm actually into it and so much more. Okay, so we could take the conversation a couple different ways here. None is whether liking anal play is gay I think that would be boring. We've talked about it before I think the more interesting thing here is. How do you think the average woman in her late teens early None s would react to a man disclosing this to her.
  • [30:10] Mike: Disclosing that he at home alone plays with his ah Butthole I think really negatively? Yeah I mean I like ah I think it is fair like it's look ah it is fair because women.
  • [30:35] Keith: Um, yeah, and is experimented extensively. Yes I think so too is that fair.
  • [30:58] Keith: Why.
  • [30:44] Mike: Because women None of all ah are going to have much less sort of in general in general women at that age range and really in all age ranges have much less sort of Masturbation Masturbatory ah kind of curiosity slash like the the experience. Like they're not Sos. She's not going to have like this crazy like oh yeah, then I tried this then I tried that she's not going to have this like laundry list of things she tried to like peek up her orgasm like many boys slash men would have so it's already going to be kind of foreign to her and it's just look I mean like it. It's like really, you're already that bored that you're you're jamming things up your butt like you're just like oh man I got I got to go all the way. Um, yeah I mean I and she would yeah she would.
  • [32:24] Keith: Her. Um, maybe he's more enlightened like maybe he's discovered that there's this secret ability to 2 X your pleasure by playing with his asshole a lot.
  • [32:33] Mike: Yeah I mean masturbation still is kind of shameful right? It's like you're fine. That's fine, but it's but but she would think to herself. Well, this would be better done with a partner I mean look he look okay see this is the thing like I'm um very I guess sex positive. But.
  • [33:02] Keith: Yes.
  • [33:11] Mike: I Find what he's doing shameful I'm like man like come on.
  • [33:37] Keith: I find it? Yeah I don't I I it I can see it I Also find it sort of shameful I'm not sure if that is the proper way to feel.
  • [33:37] Mike: I Think it is I think it is I think because I feel it. It's right? Ah, yeah, it's look I mean yeah, there's a point where these things are better done with a partner and like pretty much nobody. Yeah I mean it's look everybody is fine with just normal. Unquote Normal male masturbation scenes. You know you the ones we've discussed many times just just beating Off. Basically.
  • [34:46] Keith: I Actually I don't think that's true I reject that I think there's some material amount of Americans and even larger number of Non-americans who who find ah masturbation sort of. Completely repulsive and undignified. That's not say they don't do it but like in their minds they've they're they're less ah progressive than than we are.
  • [35:11] Mike: That's true I mean look everyone finds it. Everyone finds it. Everyone finds it largely that way and that's why like how many times have you been at your family's house or you know some sort of Christmas party or something and somebody comes down from upstairs and like man I just. Roped out I just roped out a huge and nut nobody does right? I mean nobody ever is like yeah man I just fucking and even like among friends like it's not It's basically totally unspoken like you have no I don't have you ever had somebody tell you within say 24 hours about a masturbation.
  • [36:15] Keith: Ah, right? Yeah, it's unspoken.
  • [36:24] Mike: Encounter other than like a girlfriend have you heard a guy tell you? Oh yeah, man I I just fucking beat off like crazy.
  • [36:53] Keith: Ah I am sure that that you and I have had a conversation like that at some point but we're basically like None percentile on tolerating this kind of stuff we would even do it to like say something sensational on purpose. Ah so yeah I don't.
  • [36:43] Mike: But it was unusual right.
  • [37:29] Keith: But yeah I mean it I could probably count the number of to I can't remember any any if I could I'm sure I could count it on one hand.
  • [37:16] Mike: I Mean that's partly because these are like private behaviors like you probably less likely to there. There are a number of things people are not that likely to talk about, but it's also because it's just not dignified like you said. So yeah I mean so that no, that's a good point that that a substantial percentage of the population doesn't even want to.
  • [37:58] Keith: Yeah.
  • [37:54] Mike: Imagine that? yeah other people masturbate or whatever or want to admit that they do it themselves that's true. But yeah, like when when a girl finds out there's and there's no upside for this guy. You know what I mean for yeah, my None take is like he needs to stop it like this is.
  • [38:46] Keith: I think the horses of I think the horses have left the barn here mike I don't think the Keith thinks he's discovered a new frontier of pleasure and he doesn't want to turn around and go back.
  • [38:28] Mike: He may he may wind up damaging his anus or rectum. Yeah.
  • [38:47] Mike: And I hear you I mean but there are frontiers of pleasure that are everybody knows are bad like smoking crack I think is pleasurable but it's not great. So I mean it can be possible to turn your back on something that is pleasurable. So but yeah, telling her is is is disastrous in terms of like if.
  • [39:36] Keith: Yeah.
  • [39:27] Mike: If it were the case that they kind of discovered it together and I could be put that in quotes like maybe he ah she's the one asking to do this thing and if he sort of was willing and so on and so forth or they had some sort of fantasy life or whatever I think that's much more reasonable because then she feels included and like it could be like.
  • [40:27] Keith: Um, yeah.
  • [40:06] Mike: Special or something but I still think generally where this head this heads is pegging and I think that I have to think that if there was some sort of honest scale of like how happy they are with their partner that a woman who pegs her partner usually views that negatively.
  • [41:03] Keith: yeah yes I agree ah yeah I mean I almost entirely agree with your take here. Ah the number one comment I think is sort of indicative of how Reddit people typically respond to stuff like this this versus says.
  • [40:45] Mike: Like oh God I have to fucking do this now.
  • [41:40] Keith: Prostate Play has nothing to do with being gay. Okay, we both agree with that her having an interest is a good sign. She will.
  • [41:24] Mike: Um, oh it has something to do with being gay.
  • [41:56] Keith: Yeah I think it does I think it correlates but it's not causal right? Yeah, it correlates is not causal her having an interest is a good sign. She won't see you differently after let her try and just go with it. Yeah I think that's bad advice I think there are some women who would be okay with it I've I've dated.
  • [41:38] Mike: It just doesn't mean you're gay right? Okay, go on. Yeah.
  • [42:34] Keith: Plenty of women who if I revealed this kind of thing to them would just sort of laugh and say like well okay and and wouldn't judge me or at least they wouldn't say they would judge me.
  • [42:23] Mike: Um, I thought I thought in this case didn't didn't the woman ask to finger his butthole or something have you had a woman do that.
  • [42:57] Keith: Yes, ah, let's see what he says. Ah no I have not I've had women offer to but they always ask consent and I always decline or actually.
  • [43:06] Mike: Can you I mean can.
  • [43:33] Keith: I'm not even sure that it's always been asked for consent but like I can if somebody starts you know careening toward that zone I can angle in such a way that is is enough of a hint that I'm not interested that they stop.
  • [43:35] Mike: I think we may have discussed this before. It's generally like 1 or 2 fingers that are sort of moving into the taint area and kind of heading down. There is that okay.
  • [44:09] Keith: Yes, that's right? Yeah so I have not had this experience. But yeah, this guy says occasionally during 4 play my girlfriend rubs my ass and has hinted. She's into fingering me and stimulating my prostate.
  • [44:16] Mike: Right.
  • [44:41] Keith: How you hint you're into stimulating your partner's prostate but she's implied that she would be into trying this kind of thing so to the extent it's possible to lay out a carpet that makes it a little bit safer to disclose such a thing This is probably about as good as you're going to get. I Still think that it's a little risky.
  • [44:59] Mike: Now we should move on I don't don't really understand I don't understand why a woman would propose this or be interested in this.. It's like they don't have a body part that can penetrate. Maybe they would want to peg the guy. Maybe what really is going on is she wants Anal. She wants to receive anal and so she's trying to sort of like head in that direction and like she's some sort of clever way to get him to propose it but like it's not yeah I mean there's nothing. Yeah I mean I was thinking about this the other day that like I think part of the well.
  • [45:57] Keith: Um, yeah.
  • [46:03] Mike: The main reason why women don't sexualize each other's bodies the same as we do is because they have the same body themselves. But also I mean a vagina is much less compelling of a object if you don't have a penis and so same with the guy's anus. It's just not that compelling. It's like well but I don't have a thing to put in there right.
  • [46:45] Keith: Yeah, there's nothing to do to it? yeah.
  • [46:40] Mike: So it's yeah, it's harder to sexualize an orifice if you don't have a protrusion anyway.
  • [47:07] Keith: Yeah, all right? Let's move on this is I guess still in the anal zone but but a completely different topic. This person says lost my backdoor virginity last night and now I can't go to the bathroom I'm sorry this is tmi.
  • [47:00] Mike: M.
  • [47:39] Keith: Need to shit but it hurts so bad to even fart anyway to help with this How long will I be sore. Um I brought this up because I've never had this experience and so what is it that gets sore.
  • [47:38] Mike: Oh no.
  • [47:54] Mike: Ah, ah, ah, wait. Um I didn't expect it to go this direction So what? Ah, what's wait. What what? what happened to the guy again. Oh okay, Okay, um, so you're wondering.
  • [48:36] Keith: He lost his backdoor virginity last night and now we can't go to the bathroom.
  • [48:31] Mike: Why What? Yeah what? Well I mean it's probably just a cut right.
  • [49:02] Keith: Um, that is the correct answer I I guess I had never really thought about this. Ah, let me see here I'm gonna have to scroll down a bit I I found this.
  • [48:48] Mike: M.
  • [49:01] Mike: I Really could be ah I think that in your brother in law if he's listening still probably not would ah would ah agree with this that I could be an amateur gynecologist and proctologist. Maybe well I could certainly be an amateur. Yeah.
  • [49:46] Keith: Yeah I think you you certainly have more Ah, you've done plenty of research on the topic. But so have I I don't I don't understand the biology as well as you do and the anatomy I Guess Anyway, this person says you probably have an anal fissure a tear in the Rectum lining.
  • [49:45] Mike: Unfortunately.
  • [49:57] Mike: Um, an anal fisher is not at a tear in the Rectum lining an anal, an anal fishser is a tear in the anal lining. Yeah.
  • [50:25] Keith: Usually fix themselves and are no big deal just very painful. You really shouldn't Okay, well this guy see this guy isn't as good as you.
  • [50:26] Mike: I Mean the Rectum is pretty far in like if you start tearing your rectum like that's a fucking problem like you should go to the hospital because because then then the question would be like are you? Yeah, if you go all the way through the intestine that's dangerous. And yeah I mean it's just something you get, but anal is going to be kind of close to the exit.
  • [51:17] Keith: Ah, ah yeah I guess I don't know what the difference between an anal fiser and a tear in the Rectum lining is I don't like this guy knows either. Okay.
  • [50:59] Mike: And so you'll be able to kind of see what's going on better right.
  • [51:14] Mike: Tear on the vctal lining is like a a medical emergency I think where an anal fissure is probably something you potentially could just deal with at home. Yeah, like.
  • [51:51] Keith: Okay I thought the pain might be from like chafing around your asshole itself. But apparently that's not an issue.
  • [51:47] Mike: Ah, well chafing is sort of tearing right? I mean you know this is getting going to gross I mean what else it like is I mean you can think about it like just logically like what else could it be I mean Okay, you see you have a tear the other things that could be is a bruise. Well I mean unless the guy is going at some.
  • [52:14] Keith: I suppose.
  • [52:23] Mike: Odd Angle bruising would be difficult right? How would you bruise actually pound on the muscle or whatever. So yeah I mean tearing is really the other the other ah the other possibility and I think that generally like the injuries that women sustain during sex play would be.
  • [52:56] Keith: Yeah, yeah.
  • [53:18] Keith: Yeah, okay well I'm glad you brought that up because the next topic is psa about spreading outer labia. We decided was labia not labia right.
  • [52:57] Mike: Typically tearing as well. Yeah.
  • [53:18] Mike: There's definitely it. It's labia.
  • [53:47] Keith: Psa about spreading outer labia people please stop spreading the labia so wide that it tears seriously I can't tell you how many times I've had microterers on the top of my labia from partners spreading it wide open. They're not hotel drapes. You don't need to throw them open to find the clit same concept applies for ash cheeks. The top of the crack is very delicate. That is all, um, my main experience to this was response to this was what she says how many times she's had micro tearsers on the top of her labia and then she implies that it also happens to the top of her ass cheeks is it possible. She said. It must have just been None partner over and over doing this right.
  • [54:41] Mike: I Like the idea of somebody essentially trying to to be like a forceps or like a speculum with their hands pulling and also I mean it's interesting that the thing that grabbed me actually was that she she's trying to specify that it's the outer labia. Not she's she's trying to make that distinction which is a little bit tricky.
  • [55:12] Keith: Yes, yes.
  • [55:20] Mike: Um, because yeah I mean the question is what is the point of the spreading that's happening here. Um, and I mean normally I mean okay, put it this way when you're going to give oral sex to a woman. Do you have to spread something right? Maybe their legs right.
  • [55:51] Keith: Ooho.
  • [56:06] Keith: No, not really well. Yeah, okay sorry.
  • [56:00] Mike: But then there's naturally going to fall Apart. So Then you have to say Well what?? what's going on with this woman's anatomy that there's another thing that has to be spread there I mean when people talk about their outer labia. Basically they're just talking about. They're just talking about kind of the structure that is between The. What we would call the labia like the inner labia like the things that look well the things that are homologous that meaning they're the same embryonic structure as the guy's testes testicles balsacck scrotum. That's the word I wanted right? So it's you know? So if you think about it like the inner Labia have the same general appearance as. Ah, scrotum because that's what it is. It's the woman's scrotum and but there's this structure because that like kind of goes in if you're if you're moving outward from the orifice of the vagina you have the inner labia and then it goes back in and then it goes back out and then kind of now you're just on kind of something that looks just like.
  • [57:38] Keith: Yes.
  • [57:53] Mike: Normal skin and then back in again, right? There's a little bit of a ah hump there and that's what people typically mean when they talk about our labia. So. It's not really a. They're not really lips right? It's like they're just it's just some sort of like flesh construct and so spreading those needing to spread that part implies. I'm sorry but something like morbid obesity. Um, or some unusual structure.
  • [58:58] Keith: I don't hold on hold on hold on pulling apart the labia so that you have better access to the clit is not completely insane right? like you can get it without I I intentionally didn't say because this person to do so.
  • [58:56] Mike: You mean inner you mean inner. That's the problem here. Yeah.
  • [59:37] Keith: You might grip outside the inner labia to pull up to pull them apart.
  • [59:20] Mike: But you're still pulling apart. The reason you're pulling about the inner ones there is because you're trying to access the clit and it's hard to access it if they're like if they're like mashed together because you have to kind of go up the Mucus Membrane to get to the clit.
  • [59:50] Keith: Yes, you yeah, you can get there with your tongue like I could do it hands free with my tongue pulling them apart a bit gives makes the access a bit better I can imagine. Putting my fingers on the outer labia outside the Folds of the of the outer labia in order to do so I Just can't imagine yeah like this notion. Yeah,, go ahead.
  • [01:00:18] Mike: Hang on can I ask you a question. So if ah, let's say that you didn't know and you couldn't know because you were blinded and various things. Whether the woman was face up or face down what I want what I want to know is do you think that you could figure out or maybe you're just to imagine you're in some sort of weird.
  • [01:01:16] Keith: I Got yeah I know where this question is going but continue.
  • [01:00:56] Mike: You're in the metaverse Mark Zuckerberg has put you in these sexual metaverses and you're just yeah, the question is can you tell with just your tongue. Do you think you could tell if you're going north or south on her labia. Ah like so so you're like oh I'm going to access her clit by by licking up the crevice of in the labia.
  • [01:01:40] Keith: Well can I.
  • [01:01:33] Mike: And the question is would you be certain just from your tongue that you're going to the clit or would there be some risk you were going to the anus and assuming you are able to tell could you tell our listeners how you tell which one is which direction you're going.
  • [01:02:05] Keith: Okay.
  • [01:02:17] Keith: Who Okay, when you started asking this question I was gonna just interrupt you and say yes, but I have I guess a follow up question can I go like all the way to the edge or am I just like somewhere in the middle. Okay, yeah, okay, all.
  • [01:02:05] Mike: I Think yeah. Yeah, now you can you? you're Moving. You're moving with your tongue and and it's like yeah the this is to illuminate like the structures exactly.
  • [01:02:56] Keith: I can explore with my tongue wherever I look Okay, well obviously if I go far enough I can definitely tell in one direction I'll eventually reach the belly button and in the other direction I'll eventually reach the anus right.
  • [01:02:50] Mike: Well, you would you'd event you reach the clit or the anus. The clit can be the end point here because you the and the clit is very recognizable because you will encounter the place where the labia meet and then there's a clit there. So it's pretty straightforward.
  • [01:03:35] Keith: Yeah, right? and it feels different and it feels different than the bottom of the vagina. So yeah I mean my intuition is absolutely but are you asking if I don't make it to the clit would I be able to know before I got there that I was moving in the right direction.
  • [01:03:25] Mike: How does it feel different.
  • [01:03:38] Mike: Yeah, that's right and how does it right? And how does it feel different like you're saying oh the the bottom and the top are different. So it's like how okay.
  • [01:04:11] Keith: I don't I guess I don't know my intuition is that I would be able to tell like I think maybe it's it's tighter at the top like ah the the labia would be closer together as you start moving toward the top and as you start moving toward the bottom. There isn't the same.
  • [01:04:09] Mike: Um.
  • [01:04:24] Mike: Yeah, there might be enough female anatomical variation here that you might not in principle be able to tell my intuition is that my intuition is that there is more inner labia material in the clit direction than in the anus direction. So as you move like so yeah, most.
  • [01:04:49] Keith: Amount of tightness. But.
  • [01:04:59] Keith: Um I agree I agree.
  • [01:05:03] Mike: Ah, most women like if you think about the South pole of their vagina. There's like not a whole lot of labia there which is part of the reason why actually that area does get chafed. This woman is unusual in that she has the North pole getting chafed.
  • [01:05:30] Keith: The.
  • [01:05:51] Keith: Right.
  • [01:05:34] Mike: That south pole area like is much more likely to get chafed because there's just not a whole lot of like ah there's not a whole lot of like skin to rub back and forth to roll back and forth I should say and so like then during PIV sex like it's pretty common to sort of chaf that.
  • [01:06:16] Keith: Um, well, what's going on in the lips that grip situation you've seen this right? Yeah, like there's yeah, what is that material. What is that material. That's that's.
  • [01:06:10] Mike: Where they're like completely inverted. In general I mean. Well when you so ah, go ahead. Say it.
  • [01:06:56] Keith: Gripping. Do people know what lips at grip are should we provide some clarity. Okay,, there's a thing that has become well.. There's a subreddit called lips that grip and it's normally ah a. Clip from a porn shot normally fairly close up where the guy's penetrating the woman vaginally and as he pulls Out. There's some sort of material. Ah I'm going to. Continue using the word material to to not define it. There's so some sort of material gripping on the shaft of the penis as he pulls out and this is a popular subreddit.
  • [01:08:02] Mike: Yeah I mean it's just it's just the ah the right way to think about that. Yeah, so it's it's it's it's under lubricated women basically where they're like they're so they're they're not instead of like the vagina the innards of the vagina sort of slipping against the penis. They're basically pulling out with the penis which is not I mean.
  • [01:08:52] Keith: Um.
  • [01:08:38] Mike: To some extent might be fine, but there's a point where that would become uncomfortable obviously um, the right way to think about this Keith is simply that is just to think about an uncircumcised male penis where like the four skin is mobile and the woman's vagina is the same. It's just an inverted version of a male uncircumcised penis and so the the labia just like your scrotum like.
  • [01:09:14] Keith: Okay.
  • [01:09:36] Keith: Hm.
  • [01:09:17] Mike: When you're going to scratch your scrotum. This is a thing apparently women don't know the way men scratch their scrotum when it itches is not by like pulling taut the skin on there and scratching it or indeed scratching it really at all because scratching it is complicated because it's kind of loose skin. Ah, instead you hold the chrotum between your thumb and your forefinger and you rub it. You roll the skin because there's actually like None layers of skin there right? There's there's they're they're forming kind of a ah ah container around your balls. It the same thing with the labia right there there there 2 there's the inner side and the outer side rather the the yeah the interior side the exterior side and you can basically roll the skin over some sort of inner area or contained area of the body there and that's why like if you. Put something into a woman's vagina and pull it out like there's a certain amount of skin that can roll out with it. Um, yeah, okay.
  • [01:11:28] Keith: Okay, all right I got it all right enough anatomy that let's let's move on. Um, what that was I Yeah your anatomical knowledges remains very impressive right? Yeah I.
  • [01:11:32] Mike: It's mostly from Tiktok now just have to you just have to like linger for the right amount of time on the right Tiktok videos and then suddenly you're a gynecologist. Yeah.
  • [01:12:14] Keith: I'm sort of curious to see what using your Tiktok account for 20 minutes might look like but anyway nudity is not allowed on Tiktok is that right.
  • [01:12:10] Mike: It's a lot of porn lot of sex workers. That's right, they they're they're they're not porn stars. They're corn stars on tiktock. Yes, yeah, they actually use the corn emoji. Yeah.
  • [01:12:48] Keith: Is that what they call it. Wow Wow Clever Yeah euphemism for everything. Okay, what can guys do that's similar to girls wearing Lingerie I've been thinking and girls can obviously wear lingerie. But what can a guy do for the girl.
  • [01:12:41] Mike: Really stupid. Yeah.
  • [01:12:53] Mike: A.
  • [01:13:25] Keith: There is apparently a correct answer to this I I perused the comments and like 5 of the top 10 also the same thing. Do you know what that that thing is.
  • [01:13:12] Mike: Okay, this is like ah this is like a how long have I read this nonsense quiz. Um, so it's usually the the usual answer to this type of question is it's from women I mean I'm assuming they're women answering although could be gay men or it could be a man that's just knowledgeable about these topics.
  • [01:13:49] Keith: Yep.
  • [01:13:48] Mike: Ah, the typical answer is if does it have to be clothing. Let me just ask that or can it be just a behavior. Okay, if I get I'll I'll answer both if it's a behavior so sometimes women will say like just the guy like doing something useful. So like many women you know a guy just wearing like jeans and a.
  • [01:14:19] Keith: Ah, um, yeah.
  • [01:14:27] Mike: Short or whatever but like screwing in something or like building something like women are turned on by that and if it has to be clothing. It's going to be just like well- fiting. Um well-fitting not super ultra revealaling but well-fitting sort of skin tight-ish clothes but not like.
  • [01:14:55] Keith: Right? yep.
  • [01:15:06] Mike: Not like yoga clothes like something but but well fitt and the key is well fiting like men typically don't care about the fit. Yeah.
  • [01:15:40] Keith: Right? All right? The number 1 answer 2000 up votes is tight black boxer Briefs number 2 answer is fresh aircut white t-shirt tight boxer Briefs and something to spank me with ah next one is this one this one is
  • [01:15:42] Mike: Earth.
  • [01:16:16] Keith: Against that. But it says if you don't normally wear glasses but pull out reading glasses to read with something about that drives me insane with lust four is I lit I wear my little gray boxer briefs to bed and my girl starts acting up the next one is boxer Briefs and spandex material preferably makes me go feral next one is when guys dress nice and fitted dress pants.
  • [01:16:03] Mike: Earth.
  • [01:16:54] Keith: And nice dress shirt buttoned up with the collar slightly open and sleeves rolled up to the elbow that will do it. That's basically your answer. It's like well fitted clothes and displaying competency. It's It's both those things next one I wear my tight tight box or Briefs whether they're black or red depending on the occasion. Ah.
  • [01:16:44] Mike: Yeah. Yeah, this ah tight box. Yeah.
  • [01:17:07] Mike: The the thing I would say about that is that is it is that it's okay, fine and that's a miss for me I should have said tight boxer Briefs evidently. But ah, it's really important that like he not be flabby and so forth like it's not.. It's I Guess it's true for women Laandre too. But it's the I don't know like and the other thing about it is that Yeah, they really want that area to be covered I Guess yeah in a way that men don't really totally want the woman parts to be covered. It's a little bit different. Yeah.
  • [01:18:37] Keith: yeah yeah I think what turns a woman on generally like from men in the wild versus what turns them on from their boyfriend also varies a bit I mean they're related of course. But yeah, like if a. Yeah, like men a man showing up in boxer Briefs. It would be I think intimidating in most circumstances there needs to be some sort of established safety and and comfort before you can show up in that way.
  • [01:19:19] Mike: Unless unless he's a chad and then they just want. They're just like look my boyfriend needs my boyfriend slash husband needs to not know we're doing this but you have to impregnate me now right? yeah.
  • [01:19:49] Keith: Yeah, maybe. Right? right? Yeah, So they're like maximally being sexualized. Okay, next men would you be okay with an oral sex only relationship if your partner was only willing to give blowjobs would you be okay with that and not leave them or cheat. Why Why not? Okay, so.
  • [01:20:13] Mike: Um, you will you for you. It's complicated because you would say this is not my favorite activity anyway. So now you're basically condemning me consigning me whatever to to a life with only blowjobs right? That's the problem.
  • [01:20:34] Keith: Have to put some bounds on this before we can evaluate I think but this could be an interesting thought experiment.
  • [01:21:08] Keith: Well first off I'm not going to marry someone who's going to do like only blowjobs but let's say it was let's let's say this was for some sort of medium term dating arrangement. Um, would it at what point would it stop being compelling to you. Do you think.
  • [01:21:10] Mike: Okay.
  • [01:21:24] Mike: I mean well I think I'm normal I like them a normal amount but the ah the issue here is ah whether you have to be monogamous I think so if they're if you're going to be limited to this particular activity that's tricky because what will happen.
  • [01:21:46] Keith: Mike Famously loves blowjobs listeners. Okay.
  • [01:22:04] Mike: Naturally for a man is you will start to fetishize at minimum the pib sex and so it will make it challenging to stay committed to the situation because you're being limited artificially from this other experience. Um, yeah, So I think that would be ah that would be a critical. Ah, determining factor if I had somebody that just said look I Just like to blow you a lot but you can do whatever you want the rest of the time with other people and whatnot then I think that would be good I wouldn't be ah I'd be fine I think most men would say oh good I have this person that blows me whenever I want like I have a button and I push the button and then they show up and they blow me.
  • [01:23:16] Keith: Yeah, sure sure right? Yeah, you can get the P I V scratch itch the P I V itch scratched elsewhere. Um.
  • [01:23:18] Mike: Yeah.
  • [01:23:24] Mike: I mean I would definitely select this over like no partner right? I mean it's not negative.
  • [01:23:58] Keith: Yeah, this person says don't know if I could start a relationship with those restrictions. But if something happens with my wife that made penetration an issue I wouldn't leave her cheat on her. She's great at blowjobs. But I definitely Miss Penetration there's obviously ways to supplement this though I definitely suggest incorporating toys to help keep things fresh. Strokers freshlight, flashlights, etc. What is a stroker I don't know that this doesn't happen to us often. But a yeah term we don't know also other options I'm a big fan of titty fucking. It's a go to if my wife needs a break from penetration or if it's a heavy flow period day huh.
  • [01:24:23] Mike: I Don't know that's that's one I have not heard. Yeah.
  • [01:24:50] Mike: She needs a break from penetration this sounds. Yeah, whatever it's rough.
  • [01:25:18] Keith: Yeah, and I mean yeah, that is yeah, just the entire framing of that is a little bit problematic. But but yeah I mean yeah I mean yeah, is it. Another bound is is it just blowjobs or are things like.
  • [01:25:14] Mike: Right? And she's all chafed.
  • [01:25:57] Keith: Hand Jobs ttdy fucking are those things allowed I'm not sure those materially impacted thing because I think blowjobs are probably the highest on that food pyramid.
  • [01:25:52] Mike: Yeah I mean there's another suspicion I mean it yeah depends on what else would happen I mean you have to. There's a lot of context missing here. But ah the did they say why it was blow jobs Only I think they didn't right? yeah.
  • [01:26:35] Keith: They didn't yeah ah look the obvious thing is they're young, right? like I I was in relationships when I was younger you know before I'd lost my virginity that was sort of blow job only and that's pretty typical I think.
  • [01:26:24] Mike: Okay.
  • [01:26:39] Mike: I Think that's like ah I think that's a fine. Yeah, that's a fine situation because then you have the hope of ah of something else and like also you you don't beggars can't be choosers I mean you don't have a wealth of other options necessarily available. So then you know right? So you'll take that. But.
  • [01:27:16] Keith: Um, right exactly? Yeah I was happy to have it.
  • [01:27:18] Mike: Ah I think I mean the there would be a lot of the the main like the main question here would be why and then I think the guy would also think well I mean even if women ah like PIV sex is not their Principal route to orgasms and enjoyment like it still feels pleasurable for them and more so than a blow. And it's sort of Confusing. It's like oh I I want to have sex with you in a way that's not physically pleasurable for me. It's strange I think you're right in that context of it being somebody who's not at the P I V stage yet that makes sense and is totally reasonable.
  • [01:28:45] Keith: Yeah, yeah, yeah, the generally for a long-term relationship. The answer is obviously no I think for almost everybody. But yeah, there are various bounds where you can tolerate all right next? Ah, date did a complete one eighty after spending the night went on a couple dates with a guy and we ended up sleeping together soon afterwards. Thought we had a lovely time. We gave each other extensive oral and had sex and even ended up coming albeit briefly only the second. Yeah I mean let's let's set aside whether she knows what an orgasm is only the none or none guy.
  • [01:29:14] Mike: Wait. What.
  • [01:29:26] Mike: How did you pronounce that word. How did you pronounce that a L B E I t word. Okay gone.
  • [01:30:01] Keith: Albeit okay, only the none or none guy to get me all the way within the first few times that the 0 at or None with guy. We said our goodbyes and then casually texted that evening. He hits me with a huge text. He said he wanted to discuss something delicate. He wanted to do it over text and then he told me while he enjoyed sex. He's not sure if he can proceed with me having as much hair as I do on my pussy. He texted that he got used to a certain bald look that is pretty standard in your your generation and that he would love it if I reconsidered to be clear.
  • [01:30:25] Mike: O.
  • [01:31:10] Keith: This is about one half an inch or so of neatly trimmed and shaved along the size pubic hair like what the fuck it's such a weird and specific none that I really don't know how to respond I politely told him that his text was really weird and I'm not sure how to respond so I just want to point out a couple things here. The first is she has some grammar stuff here that like. Really bothers me like she says I went on a couple dates with a guy and we ended up sleeping together soon afterwards does that mean after each of those dates or after the None date and another is a third like it's unclear that bothers me I know this doesn't matter and I'm calling back to something we talked off here which is minor grammatical things drive me crazy.
  • [01:31:37] Mike: This yeah.
  • [01:31:52] Mike: It's the set. It's after the None date or whatever. It's not. It's not after every single date she had sex with him. It's it's the None one? Yeah yeah, it makes sense.
  • [01:32:20] Keith: Okay, okay so they've had sex once and then I yes she she says it's such a weird and specific None what is I don't think she knows what a None means um
  • [01:32:22] Mike: So he was excited about her and then suddenly he's made way less excited he he I mean that's a None from her perspective. She's miss. Ah I mean she she she doesn't understand that he's dealing with something pretty delicate here right.
  • [01:33:14] Keith: Yeah I guess all right right? All right? all right? So let's skip the vocabulary lesson is okay, we've talked about pubic care planning. But I'm trying to get a feel for.
  • [01:32:58] Mike: He didn't want to in the middle of sex be like oh bitch, you got to shave that thing like you didn't want to do that? yeah.
  • [01:33:50] Keith: I Mean this guy is right like most young women now completely shave at least for early sexual encounters. They may eventually walk that back. But ah I think women if they think that there's a Ch at least in my experience almost every new vagina I experience.
  • [01:33:40] Mike: So.
  • [01:34:29] Keith: Is is completely shaved now I think what's going on is they think that's what men want and so or maybe they've been convinced by. You know the predominant culture that this is what they're supposed to do.
  • [01:34:30] Mike: I Think it's smart. It's like why wouldn't they I mean it it depends on what their goals are but I assume their goal is for him to have their thinking to themselves I Want this guy to have the best possible experience right? because they want to their their goal here is to like initiate a relationship. Ah typically.
  • [01:35:28] Keith: Right? yes.
  • [01:35:10] Mike: And so yeah I mean or will you say with you and yeah I mean why wouldn't they do that I mean it's let's say that raises your rating by point 3 or something of the encounter out of 10 or something. Yeah, that's really smart.
  • [01:35:44] Keith: Sure, Yes, yeah, and I mean I agree with her notion that like what's the difference. It's my choice. Whatever like I don't disagree with her about that. But your point which is I think the thing that men are expecting now is full shaved. Is is correct like I think most men I mean I'm look I'm I'm in my forty s right? So I've seen plenty of Vaginas I was having sex before everybody's shaved to their vagina and so it's fine. But yeah I think there's some.
  • [01:36:08] Mike: Even if you weren't.
  • [01:36:58] Keith: Plurality and maybe majority of men who when presented with a unshaven penis Penis Vagina will be a little bit. Yeah, like a little bit turned off. This guy is sort of on the extreme of that. But that's the that's sort of the risky run. It's like not shaving your legs right? like.
  • [01:37:07] Mike: You do know by the way that your your grammar police thing like there is probably there probably actually is one woman yelling at her, whatever her airpods right now Vulva not vagina, You don't grow hair in your vagina Just you know there are women that go nuts about that. Grammatical distinction or or a link a vocabulary distinction I don't I don't care I don't Care. Um I Understand what you mean.
  • [01:38:06] Keith: Okay I will endeavor to be better, but in my case in my case in my case, it was bad anatomy. Not bad grammar.
  • [01:38:05] Mike: No, you don't think that her vagina is on the outside. Whatever it doesn't matter. It's right, it's its vocabulary or something doesn't matter. Okay, yeah, the the thing about it. Okay, so even if you were in a context where okay if if if if if a shaved vagina was or vulva was there? Yeah, um. Was like considered taboo then or or you know somehow a negative then of course they would not do it. However, even if you were in a situation where in in say american culture where it was unusual say the None s the 1970 s where the porn at least depicts a lot of free flowing hair. There. Ah. A woman would still get a plus something maybe even a larger plus on that None date the None sexual date by shaving because the guy's going to be so excited and so it doesn't really matter I understand that they're keeping up with the joneses in this case but it actually doesn't matter like they're still going to get a plus something and it and all that's happened people. Okay people want to say oh um.
  • [01:40:02] Keith: Yeah, yeah.
  • [01:39:59] Mike: This is some sort of like anti-feminist situation. No, it's not that it's that each individual woman is making a choice to uplevel herself to the extent. You know the ones who are doing this and they've just all realized that it's a plus something and yeah, the men have become accustomed to it. But I mean that's not because they're ah.
  • [01:40:49] Keith: Right.
  • [01:40:39] Mike: They're mistreating women or some there can be an element of that later potentially but but that's that's not the point. The point is they've just realized just like wearing deodorant or showering or I mean there's all kinds of behaviors right.
  • [01:41:18] Keith: Or putting makeup on and you know doing your hair in a certain way and keeping yourself in shape like there's various things you can do that. Are you know, collectively bargained and agreed upon as being attractive and you know you can Forego them. Of course you can do whatever you want with your pubic hair. But.
  • [01:41:11] Mike: Right? Yes, It's like I'm so I'm right. Writing. So.
  • [01:41:58] Keith: If you do so some men are going to be put off by it and.
  • [01:41:41] Mike: Yeah, there's there's there's a collection of men on Reddit who will say they prefer hair I actually have to say I don't I don't believe them I don't believe them right? I think that I think they're virtue signaling and that actually and and and and and and I don't think it has anything to do with wanting the woman to.
  • [01:42:12] Keith: There are yeah I think there's some virtue signaling going on there.
  • [01:42:18] Mike: The other thing people will say is they want men want the woman to appear prepubescent I Don't think it's that either. It's that men want to see as much as they possibly can they like the idea that they're the woman is like completely denuded for them and ah hair is hair other than on your head is just isn't that feminine. Like it's not just that It's not considered that feminine. It really does sort of masculinize the person a bit and so men want the woman to be as feminine as possible and so there really is just like a deep ah kind of almost biological drive that men have where it's hotter to have it that way. Um, and yeah, it's annoying for the woman. But.
  • [01:43:22] Keith: Right? right.
  • [01:43:51] Keith: Um, yeah.
  • [01:43:33] Mike: Yeah, yeah, even if we lived in a society where there was no shaving of any kind that went on the first woman that started shaving everything would be way more attractive to men like immediately. She would start winning.
  • [01:44:14] Keith: Yep, all right I agree this person says would it be embarrassing to take my hatachchi abroad. Do you know what? a hatachi is yes I think they normally need to be plugged in because they have so much power. But I think you can get. Ah.
  • [01:44:05] Mike: Um, it's It's sort of a relatively large vibrator. That's the important thing. Yes, this is yes, that's nice.
  • [01:44:50] Keith: Cordless ones now. Ah okay, she goes on I'll be going to Thailand for nearly a month soon and I'm one of those need my leg in a bear trap wind has to be just right in the best position to come type of girl which means I usually need my hatachi to come with my partner I'm just wondering if that's okay to take abroad or is it a bit embarrassing to take through the airport. Just wanting to enjoy coming while away but at the same time the thought of airport security asks me what this huge vibrator is in front of a bunch of people makes me want to sink into the ground. So I hear that's kind of embarrassing and it's sort of an unfortunate situation. She's found herself in ah it would be super annoying if I had to have. Some sort of elaborate paraphernalia to masturbate and I had to decide whether or not I wanted to put it in my carry on or not um I think.
  • [01:45:57] Mike: Well that used to be the case for a lot of men because there was no internet pornography and so if a man. Yeah I guess you could go buy a magazine or something but it was tricky right.
  • [01:46:29] Keith: Yes, there was a time there was a time I remember so it was like when I was in college and I would I would sometimes buy penthouse at the airport because it's always embarrassing to buy a magazine like that. Then probably less so but and and I was young enough so that I was embarrassed by this kind of stuff but I would sort of look forward to the opportunity to buy it relatively anonymously? Um, but yeah I don't need penthouse anymore I could probably yeah.
  • [01:47:03] Mike: Sure. Right? So I mean it's it's a form of paraphernalia ah it's not I mean yeah I don't think whatever I mean I yeah I think there are women that require this severe or strong of a touch to to get there I was just talking to a woman a couple days ago who was describing. Kind of needing a lot of pressure then she told me she had and she's listening then she told me she'd had None orgasms in a setting and then we discussed that she needed to verify those hang on she was going to so she's actually game and you know who you are when I know you're listening.
  • [01:48:35] Keith: That's not.
  • [01:48:28] Mike: Ah, she said she was game to ah validate this for me and I told her well the way you validate it is with a with your anus and then she said my anus contracts or erasmus and I said yeah, it does and then I was like well you could either point a camera at your anus the entire time and then we could go through the footage.
  • [01:49:22] Keith: Aha yep.
  • [01:49:03] Mike: and and I said and she said well what we be looking for and I said I'm looking for those point four second apart contractions which surprised her the specificity the point 4 didn't turn her on it. Just surprised her and then she said then I found out that she likes during long car rides with her boyfriend to have him rub her klit for 2 to 3 hours continuously while he's driving her places.
  • [01:49:33] Keith: Yeah.
  • [01:50:02] Keith: Oh my God would I like if I were a female would I enjoy receiving or would I like my girlfriend imposing that on me.
  • [01:49:43] Mike: Would you like that.
  • [01:49:56] Mike: Well some guys I could see enjoying it that was the thing would you would you would you enjoy? Ah would you enjoy? ah having your left hand on the steering wheel and your right hand sort of over across a woman's sort of leg that's draped a little bit and and rubbing her clit the entire time.
  • [01:50:45] Keith: Okay, so we're we're driving an American car here. Okay yeah, okay.
  • [01:50:36] Mike: Yeah, we're in America yeah, if it was your european trip and you were in say London we would have to switch this or not. You wouldn't be doing it in London proper but you're in the u k somewhere then you'd have to have your right hand on the steering wheel and your left hand on her clip but it doesn't make that much of a difference.
  • [01:51:11] Keith: Um, well and I correct and I am left handed so that would probably be better for her. Um.
  • [01:51:06] Mike: These 2 this this person also ah the the person that would have in in question, the male who would have been doing this would have been left-handed as well. He seemed he's seemed fine with ah rubbing her klit with his right hand but do you is that a is that a I couldn't decide 2 to 3 hours just seems like a long time.
  • [01:51:40] Keith: Okay.
  • [01:52:00] Keith: I don't think I want to ah to borrow expression from an old friend of ours finger bang my partner for 3 hours in a row while driving I know this is it exactly finger banging but you know yeah I look.
  • [01:52:02] Mike: And Finger bang. Yeah, interesting.
  • [01:52:39] Keith: I think it would be kind of cool if my partner you know, pulled up her skirt and invited me to fondle her but the the I'd like there to be a time box on that that is significantly shorter than 3 hours
  • [01:52:27] Mike: Right.
  • [01:52:38] Mike: Um, yeah, there's right, there's something about look part of the male attraction to the woman is and actually it goes back to this ah depilation the right terminology for removing hair hair Removal topic. Part of it is like that The man wants there to be the secret prize or whatever this this thing that's kept in secrecy that's available only sometimes and he has to sort of figure it out like men like that men want to be like the the mouse in the in the maize finding the cheese. Yeah, so we do like that and so ah.
  • [01:53:44] Keith: Um, yeah. Sometimes correct. Yeah, the pursuit.
  • [01:53:55] Mike: So so what? why does that have something do with the hair removal because it makes you're making the pride you're peeking up the price you're like oh it really is that it's like oh you, you thought of me you made the prize really cool for me and so the guy likes that and ah, but but on the flip side. If the woman wants you to rub her clit for 2 hours or 3 hours during a car drive. That's the opposite now it's just you're not a mouse in a maze. You're a mouse just being plopped down into a you know two foot by two foot rectangular square room with a cheese just right there and you're like but but.
  • [01:55:14] Keith: Yeah.
  • [01:55:02] Mike: But it's just this is getting boring like I want you know? So yeah I mean the notion that it would happen occasionally and it would happen for some moderate amount of time is cool. But yeah I mean this this level and it sucks for a woman who has a high sex drive right? I mean there's not what can she do.
  • [01:55:25] Keith: Ah, yeah.
  • [01:55:55] Keith: Yeah I guess I mean ah I mean she she just has the experience that men have which is like constantly being not quite satisfied. It's it's hard for me to feel too much empathy here right? like it's.
  • [01:55:55] Mike: Yeah, that's right gather Just yeah and it's hearts right.
  • [01:56:35] Keith: It's something that's similar to but not as bad as the male general experience.
  • [01:56:21] Mike: That's true. That's that's actually a good point is that you're you're just you're just in the situation. A man is in um I guess the 1 caveat would be if that if as a woman if you had those desires and you were willing to change male partners kind of constantly there there. Yeah, there are a lot of guys that would find that compelling. Ah.
  • [01:56:49] Keith: Um, yeah.
  • [01:56:57] Mike: Would be genuinely super excited about that for a period of time and then would say oh this is getting annoying. Yeah.
  • [01:57:21] Keith: Yeah, exactly I mean I can imagine being compelled by that invitation but I can also imagine many situations most situations where it would like eventually get irritating and and. Whatever anti-attractive Unattractive. It's it would yeah repulsive might be a little bit strong but it would it would make it so it would make it so that I felt less desire. Yeah yeah.
  • [01:57:42] Mike: Right? Repulsive repellent. Yeah. Yeah,, That's right, it becomes more clinical. It's like oh I have oh now I have to do this? Ah but that's your your your take is totally your take is totally right in the sense that ah that it becomes just she's just turning into a man because if a man said hey.
  • [01:58:37] Keith: Yeah, there's that word again. Clinical I Think that's the right thing here. It's It's not arousing anymore.
  • [01:58:42] Mike: Ah, honey we're going to be driving for 4 hours and I just want you to beat me off and keep me hard for 3 of those 4 hours and then at the end give me an orgasm. She'd just be like really there'd just be like a long sigh like oh okay.
  • [01:59:17] Keith: Oh. Ah, yeah.
  • [01:59:14] Mike: And so yeah, there's like that and and and what that is is. It's the the availability of cock is too high. It's like it's like look if it was an occasional thing fine. but but yeah it would just be annoying. Ah I will get back I will get back to everybody on the 15 orgasms the anus pressure plate or whatever we have to do.
  • [01:59:48] Keith: Yeah, yeah, all right.
  • [02:00:09] Keith: You know when you know when they have guests that they're trying to protect on a show like 60 minutes they like blur their face and disguise their voice somehow can you do that with an anus in such a way that the embarrassment over her asshole doesn't.
  • [01:59:51] Mike: But I of course expressed expressed high skepticism on the fifteen orgasms
  • [02:00:10] Mike: 6
  • [02:00:48] Keith: Doesn't Cloud things here.
  • [02:00:32] Mike: I'm confident that I will not get a video of her anus that won't happen. Um, ah and also I've tried to ah persuade this very. She's listened to every single episode of the show this a very committed listener who we appreciate.
  • [02:00:59] Keith: Okay, that's too bad.
  • [02:01:22] Keith: Yes.
  • [02:01:04] Mike: To come on the show and she said that she would be willing to come on the show if her boyfriend who we don't know as well were willing to do an m fm threesome and I don't then my None thing was wait. Wait are you propositioning me and it was like no no, no, she wants it to be someone that they don't know which makes sense. Ah, ah.
  • [02:01:47] Keith: Um.
  • [02:01:59] Keith: Well I think everybody pretends they're not propositioning somebody after they've been declined.
  • [02:01:43] Mike: I meant I asked if they were propositioning me sure. But I think in this case I look it's It's just that you know asking. Okay, the thing that could be considered really Const considered as a threat would be the Mmf Threesome. It's like hey yeah you want an mmf with me. That's actually like a threat. It's like oh so you're you're offering a dick in my ass. This was not that this is Mfm but still I didn't take it to be ah ah an offer I'm assuming I'm going to take her at her word. That's not that I Also think this guy's not going to be willing to do an mfm even though she wants to.
  • [02:03:15] Keith: Yeah, it's too bad. She's not interested in with you that that takes it out of our hands here.
  • [02:02:55] Mike: Ah.
  • [02:03:05] Mike: I Wouldn't wait. She might with you Ah, but the ah but you're on an E N M relationship.
  • [02:03:38] Keith: Okay, well yeah, that's not on the table either I we are I I am we are I think yeah, we are ah my girlfriend and I are but ah.
  • [02:03:36] Mike: Um, yeah.
  • [02:04:15] Keith: High on the list of things I would like to do given the liberties of a e n m relationship is not an MFThree so that might be that might be the last possible thing I would even consider before we before we get into things that I would just like outright reject.
  • [02:04:07] Mike: Right. Yeah, this reminds me of the this reminds me of the listener that emailed in and asked if we ever like before after or during the show just you know, pulled out our cocks and masturbate it together and I was like I was like no no, we don't do that like come On. It's wrong with you like.
  • [02:04:59] Keith: Yes, right are right? Yeah, yeah, we're not going to do it. Yeah, all right listeners.
  • [02:04:52] Mike: Yeah, people are people try so hard to get like jerk off material. It's like no, we don't We don't want to do that? Yeah sorry.
  • [02:05:29] Keith: Ah, you made it through another hour of your mileage may vary. This was episode 69 a very nice number. We famously pay $10 for any feedback we receive on the show if you'd like to deliver a sum and we'd really appreciate it if you do you can do so on Twitter at Ymmvpod or by email at http://ymmvpod@http://gmail.com thanks for listening and we hope you'll join us next week on your mileage may vary.